Okami Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 Moon and Terra have a bigger and grander message, way bigger scope, and is just way better written than anything else in the game. It's basically WHY you play the game. Shizuru and Chihayas routes were both so awful I don't know how I made it through them. Shimokura should be fired and never be allowed to write. I disagree every route is equally important. Also the only route I thought was bad is Terra. Chihaya's route was my favorite one. The Shizuru route doesn't have any real important plot points, you could probably skip most of it and not really miss anything to be honest. The most important part of it is how you get to know Guardian better as an organization, but you'll be learning plenty about them later anyways. The routes with the most relevant plot details are probably Kotori and Akane. Kotori explains a lot about Kotarou's character and Akane gives a lot of explanation about Gaia, the various factions within it, their motivations, the nature of the key, etc. I disagree with this too after all things about Kotarou that are said in her route don't apply to other routes. Quote
Flutterz Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 No,never,Its like saying you hate loli. True, but sadly loli is the only redeeming feature of Shizuru's route. Quote
DimDito Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 No,never,Its like saying you hate loli. I don't like loli, and I may be going to hell for that. However, I like Shizuru as a character. I guess she has this unique kind of 'moe'. But I don't think it'll compensate for the route. AMMSY 1 Quote
Okami Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 The thing that a lot people are misunderstanding is that they are asuming that everything that is said in one route aplies to others witch is not a case as every route is happening in another cicle mileniums of years stands between each routes witch was explaind in moon and Chihaya's routes. Quote
Decay Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 Going to hell for not liking loli, what kind of bizarro religion is that? I need to know so I can stay far, far away. I did like Shizuru's character though. I found her most interesting when she was more mischievous and going along with Kotorou's schemes, and I wish they played up that side of her more. I disagree with this too after all things about Kotarou that are said in her route don't apply to other routes. I think it's important to know why Kotarou's personality is the way it is and why things turn out differently in the Terra route. The thing that a lot people are misunderstanding is that they are asuming that everything that is said in one route aplies to others witch is not a case as every route is happening in another cicle mileniums of years stands between each routes witch was explaind in moon and Chihaya's routes. Well, kind of. I wouldn't say actual time passes. It's more that it's just alternate timelines entirely. But the common route and the main 5 routes start from the same branch point, when Kotori saves Kotarou's life. Quote
DimDito Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 Well, kind of. I wouldn't say actual time passes. It's more that it's just alternate timelines entirely. But the common route and the main 5 routes start from the same branch point, when Kotori saves Kotarou's life. Not Lucia's route. Quote
Okami Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 Going to hell for not liking loli, what kind of bizarro religion is that? I need to know so I can stay far, far away. I did like Shizuru's character though. I found her most interesting when she was more mischievous and going along with Kotorou's schemes, and I wish they played up that side of her more. I think it's important to know why Kotarou's personality is the way it is and why things turn out differently in the Terra route. Well, kind of. I wouldn't say actual time passes. It's more that it's just alternate timelines entirely. But the common route and the main 5 routes start from the same branch point, when Kotori saves Kotarou's life. No they don't and there are 2 clear proofs for that. First is that in other routes Kagari died but nothing happened to Kotarou and if Kotori saved Kotarou in other routes in the same way as in her route Kotarou would die without Kagari around or losed his powers and ended on verge of death. Kotori was a druid and she was getting her power to use as many familiars from Kagari once Kagari dies she wouldn't have enough energy to support Kotarou witch would lead to her death and then Kotarou's death as well as he is her familiar. And if she broke her contract with him his wound would reappear and he would be on werge of death. That was clearly explained in Kotori's route. Another proof is that in Kotori's route Kotarou was going to school before the accident with the same classmates but in Terra route he wasn't going to school and was much older than his classmates. I don't know why everyone is missing something as clear as that, does nobody read their VNs cerfily or something? Quote
Decay Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 I just assumed the link with Kagari was a plot hole (perhaps resulting from the multiple writers being on the project not communicating enough?), because everything else lines up. Otherwise, I honestly can't explain it. And even still, if you take that as evidence for Kotarou only being bound as a familiar in Kotori's route, that enables an even bigger contradiction, Kotarou's personality. Remember, his entire personality is a result of Kotori's subconcious mind control influencing him. He's more outgoing, more friendly to Kotori, has a sense of humor right up Kotori's alley, etc, because he became her familiar. This is consistent throughout the common route and all heroine routes. Without Kotori's influence, his personality is what it is in the Terra route, which is completely different in almost every way. As for the school thing, that was a fabricated memory. Kotarou's memories were erased and new ones were fabricated for him. While he was comatose for several years, he did not age. That's why he is older in Terra than in the rest of the routes. This part is actually pointed out if you get one of the bad endings in Terra, the part where you confront Kagari. You can pick an option that gets you fatally injured and Kotori has to save you, bringing things full circle back to where the common route begins. And really, the whole thing with Moon was that the major revelation, the major branch point they never considered before, was when Kotarou gets injured and Kotori saves him. Changing that changed everything and allowed the world to be saved. Not changing that results in a Kotarou who ends up in a coma and loses his memories, causing too much lost time for him to save the world. Anyways, although I can't explain all of the discrepancies, there's still enough proof to make me believe these things, and other explanations have just as many contradictions imo. Quote
Wahfuu Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 No they don't and there are 2 clear proofs for that. First is that in other routes Kagari died but nothing happened to Kotarou and if Kotori saved Kotarou in other routes in the same way as in her route Kotarou would die without Kagari around or losed his powers and ended on verge of death. Kotori was a druid and she was getting her power to use as many familiars from Kagari once Kagari dies she wouldn't have enough energy to support Kotarou witch would lead to her death and then Kotarou's death as well as he is her familiar. And if she broke her contract with him his wound would reappear and he would be on werge of death. That was clearly explained in Kotori's route. Another proof is that in Kotori's route Kotarou was going to school before the accident with the same classmates but in Terra route he wasn't going to school and was much older than his classmates. I don't know why everyone is missing something as clear as that, does nobody read their VNs cerfily or something? More like the writers never really worked together at all to fix any of the errors, every route is basically it's own thing. It's pretty consistent if you follow the main writers story, though. Also: You know the Key that appears in Terra is not the same key that appears in the character routes. It's constantly said their was another key before the one that appears during the heroine routes, in every timeline. The thing that a lot people are misunderstanding is that they are asuming that everything that is said in one route aplies to others witch is not a case as every route is happening in another cicle mileniums of years stands between each routes witch was explaind in moon and Chihaya's routes. Uhh, what? No, not even remotely. It's EMPHATICALLY stated that The divergence point is when Kotarou attempts to attack the Key or leave it alone. It's said in Terra and in Moon. Theres literally 0 evidence to support what you said. If you're talking about Sakuya, then His situation is entirely seperate from the tree of possibilities. He's one of the :many: civilizations to fall in Rapture. His world was destroyed, he did what Kotarou did in Shizuru's ending to survive it and make it to the next cycle. This has literally nothing to do with what Kagari is trying to do in moon. For the last time, Romeo wrote Kotori, Akane, Moon, Terra. Of course if you try and piece every detail together it's not going to make sense, because the project has a terrible throw-away writer writing 2 of the routes (Shizuru, Chihaya) and randomly has R07 doing an Omake. Rewrites project is flawed to the bone because of the multiple writer mess that it has. If you only take the above, most of the details are consistent. Quote
Decay Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 Lucia's route is really good, I thought, but pretty much irrelevant. Still, it's probably the second best route behind Akane's. Ryukishi07 is just a really good writer. Quote
Okami Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 More like the writers never really worked together at all to fix any of the errors, every route is basically it's own thing. It's pretty consistent if you follow the main writers story, though. Also: You know the Key that appears in Terra is not the same key that appears in the character routes. It's constantly said their was another key before the one that appears during the heroine routes, in every timeline. I cannot stretch enough how useless and contradictory Shizuru, Chihaya and Lucia's routes are to the main story. Lucia's might as well be read as an Omake and Chihaya/Shizuru's should just be forgotten. Thats why I sai that all routes are eqaly important becouse every route is really story for it self and dosen't have much to do with other routes but they are not errors/plot holes as They are all happening in a difrent timline/world. Also there is no main story all of them are main stories. You also misunderstood for Key Another key was refering to Key of the moon there are two keys key of moon and key of earth key of moon is the one in a moon route, and in terra and heroine routes it is key of earth Quote
Clephas Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 My scores for the routes Common 2.9/10 Chihaya 7.1/10 Lucia 6.8/10 Shizuru 6.6/10 Kotori 4.7/10 Akane 7.7/10 Moon 7.2/10 Terra 8/10 FINAL 6.8/10 This game suffers from IPS (Idiot Protagonist Syndrome) throughout the entire common route, the heroines are overall slightly weaker than is preferable in a story like this, and the entire map-filling feature of the game would drive anyone who hates meaningless minigame activities insane. Silvz 1 Quote
Clephas Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 Also, considering Key's target audience (fanboys of its earlier works), Rewrite's genre-switching and the excessive gaps in quality between its various routes and the story flow greatly weakened it as a game. To be blunt, the common route feels like 'Key if Key sucked donkey turds' and the heroine routes feel like 'second rate chuuni' in most cases. The degree to which the writing and scenario quality explodes (in a good way) in Terra in the Japanese version made it feel as if it really were a completely separate game, made at a separate time, with only vague linkages with the rest of the game. I honestly didn't have a problem with dropping the heroines as they existed in the rest of the game, but I know that Key fanboys might have trouble with that kind of thing, so I don't blame them if they developed a distaste for that aspect of Terra. Darklord Rooke 1 Quote
Decay Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 It's amazing how Clephas' opinions on the matter is almost the complete polar opposite of my own. I don't think it's possible to have a difference of opinion this massive. Quote
Silvz Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 So Clephas, I didn't understand most of your post. What you meant is that Rewrite is a good game, but the heroines only follow Key's stereotypes from earlier games? Quote
Clephas Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 No, I thought Rewrite was average at best, and it was only redeemed by Terra, whose writing and scenario quality was higher than the rest of the game. To me, the heroine paths were only redeemed by their weak connection to the Moon/Terra true ending. Also, genre-switching refers to the sudden shift from a certain type of story to another type of story. Rewrite starts out like a moege/charage and ends up like a chuuni game toward the end of each path. While the early part of the story hints that there is something shadowy/dark behind the scenes of the city, Kotarou's attitude and manner of speech during those scenes makes taking it seriously difficult, and so the sheer difference in atmosphere between the heroine paths and the common route seems abrupt and poorly planned. The map minigame that appears frequently in the common route also serves to weaken the story, simply because it feels like an interruption whenever it pops up, not to mention that it is annoying enough that even when I managed to get into the common route, it popped me right back out. That killed the common route, at least for me. As for my opinion of the heroines... they would have been better off in a normal Key game, and it is obvious that the writers were trying to draw in the normal Key audience, who love the quirky females that generally define their games. Oddly, Shizuru's character is not out of place in low-quality chuuni (there is a heroine similar to her in ExE by Yuzusoft), but Chihaya, Kotori, and Lucia all feel distinctly out of place, at least to me. Akane... could pass for a 'haraguro' heroine with a weak heart in just about any VN, so it is impossible to call her out of place in any genre, lol. It is also why her path is so surprising in its strength. I could go on all day about the heroine problems in the game (at least some of which were caused because Key didn't keep the story to a single writer, which would have been best in a game with a strong true path/ending, because of the necessity of 'connecting the dots'). Edit: Shizuru's path was just badly done, aside from whether her character fit in with the game's atmosphere. Silvz 1 Quote
Okami Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 No, I thought Rewrite was average at best, and it was only redeemed by Terra, whose writing and scenario quality was higher than the rest of the game. To me, the heroine paths were only redeemed by their weak connection to the Moon/Terra true ending. Also, genre-switching refers to the sudden shift from a certain type of story to another type of story. Rewrite starts out like a moege/charage and ends up like a chuuni game toward the end of each path. While the early part of the story hints that there is something shadowy/dark behind the scenes of the city, Kotarou's attitude and manner of speech during those scenes makes taking it seriously difficult, and so the sheer difference in atmosphere between the heroine paths and the common route seems abrupt and poorly planned. The map minigame that appears frequently in the common route also serves to weaken the story, simply because it feels like an interruption whenever it pops up, not to mention that it is annoying enough that even when I managed to get into the common route, it popped me right back out. That killed the common route, at least for me. As for my opinion of the heroines... they would have been better off in a normal Key game, and it is obvious that the writers were trying to draw in the normal Key audience, who love the quirky females that generally define their games. Oddly, Shizuru's character is not out of place in low-quality chuuni (there is a heroine similar to her in ExE by Yuzusoft), but Chihaya, Kotori, and Lucia all feel distinctly out of place, at least to me. Akane... could pass for a 'haraguro' heroine with a weak heart in just about any VN, so it is impossible to call her out of place in any genre, lol. It is also why her path is so surprising in its strength. I could go on all day about the heroine problems in the game (at least some of which were caused because Key didn't keep the story to a single writer, which would have been best in a game with a strong true path/ending, because of the necessity of 'connecting the dots'). Edit: Shizuru's path was just badly done, aside from whether her character fit in with the game's atmosphere. I acctualy think that this is a good part of rewrite as they menage to mix so much diferent generes in one story and to put something for everyone in it. Also I am not a Key fanboy I do love Rewrite but I didn't think much about LB! and I haven't played their other titles, I also prefer serious stories (True that dosen't mean I dislike Moege) and I still disliked Terra. True I do respect Key becouse they have guts to relese all-ages titles for PC. Quote
AMMSY Posted April 28, 2014 Author Posted April 28, 2014 Anyone mind helping me out here? At the end of Shizuru route, Why Didn't Kotarou go with Shizuru to saftey?? >< I didn't get it at all. Sakuya survived pretty well as a human familiar.. so whats the point? Quote
MysteriousFayth Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 Anyone mind helping me out here? At the end of Shizuru route, Why Didn't Kotarou go with Shizuru to saftey?? >< I didn't get it at all. I believe it is because by that point, Kotarou was being kept alive via a contract with Shizuru. The strain of the contract had already robbed Shizuru of her voice and hearing. Kotarou chose to remain behind and release the contract in order to protect her from the life-draining effects of maintaining a contract constantly. I'm not sure why he chose to remain behind rather than rewrite himself within the shelter. It's my fervent belief that, when Shizuru emerges from the shelter she is able to establish a new contract with Kotarou (ala Sakuya and Chihaya) and they live happily ever after. So I tell myself anyway since Shizuru is my favourite heroine and loving a tree is just too sad. XD Quote
AMMSY Posted April 28, 2014 Author Posted April 28, 2014 I believe it is because by that point, Kotarou was being kept alive via a contract with Shizuru. The strain of the contract had already robbed Shizuru of her voice and hearing. Kotarou chose to remain behind and release the contract in order to protect her from the life-draining effects of maintaining a contract constantly. I'm not sure why he chose to remain behind rather than rewrite himself within the shelter. It's my fervent belief that, when Shizuru emerges from the shelter she is able to establish a new contract with Kotarou (ala Sakuya and Chihaya) and they live happily ever after. So I tell myself anyway since Shizuru is my favourite heroine and loving a tree is just too sad. XD Thats my point! He stayed alive as a tree right? So whats the difference?? If he released the contract and could stay alive, and he did, so he could go with her to safety. It seem like the whole "became a tree" thing just there to over complicate things. Quote
Flutterz Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 Thats my point! He stayed alive as a tree right? So whats the difference?? If he released the contract and could stay alive, and he did, so he could go with her to safety. It seem like the whole "became a tree" thing just there to over complicate things. Maybe it's because trees can more easily get energy from the Earth? Kind of like making a contract with the Earth instead. Quote
AMMSY Posted April 28, 2014 Author Posted April 28, 2014 Maybe it's because trees can more easily get energy from the Earth? Kind of like making a contract with the Earth instead. Your explanation does sounds feasible, but it sure feels like we are looking for "excuses" that make sense >< Oh well... Quote
MysteriousFayth Posted April 28, 2014 Posted April 28, 2014 Thats my point! He stayed alive as a tree right? So whats the difference?? If he released the contract and could stay alive, and he did, so he could go with her to safety. It seem like the whole "became a tree" thing just there to over complicate things. Btw, I hope you've read Chihaya's route as well as I am touching on some stuff from that one. =3 It's a tree because, during Salvation, only plant-life survives. All animal life is re-absorbed in to the planet. Changing in to a tree familiar allowed Kotarou to survive Salvation without losing his sense of self. Though this doesn't explain why he had to stay behind. My speculation would be that he couldn't rewrite himself in to a human familiar and remain as "Kotarou" which would defeat the purpose of him living for Shizuru's sake. So he stayed behind and using "something that can survive Salvation" he began rewriting himself so that they could meet again. He became that tree and could be summoned through a contract, but since he would have enough power on his own after rewriting himself, he wouldn't be a drain of the life of the Summoner. It's just my speculation though, I can't deny that it is a bit of a plot-hole. XD Quote
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