Let's talk about Villains

[nohman]

You say that world is not a better place in a hands of a single individual but results say different.

 

A lot of people supported what Light was doing just as much people who support their government if not even more.

You say that for the most part people endorse their governments but I really doubt that that is true,  you are probably one of lucky few if you live in country in witch you have government that you support eater that or you personally just live a nice life so you don't take notice of politics that much. In my case I nearly died twice as a child thanks to our governments stupidity and lack  of concerns for civilians. But our government aside I wonder how much people really take part in democratic process, or can you say with certainty that you know everything that is happening in your country and that you know everything that your government does? Probably not. In case of Light you can at least see that he is giving far better results then any government  witch is enough to determine that he is a good guy who makes a word a better place.

[Clephas]

Do the ends justify the means... depends on your outlook.  I don't believe in absolute morality (since morality is fundamentally subjective), so I tend to lean toward yes... but in the end, you can argue either way and reach a 'right' answer.  Villains are relative, as well... I mean, Reinhardt's idea of a new world in Dies Irae was a hell from many (most, since it was basically a Darwinian Valhalla) people's perspective, but from the perspective of many of those who followed him, it was an idea that represented an ideal world.  From the point of view of Schreiber or Wilhelm, he was the ultimate good, lol.

[Okami]

I wasn't really trying to paint the world as picture perfect or anything, but trying to underline that a government's power is usually considered legitimate. A single man committing mass murder on his own initiative isn't. Light wasn't bound by any system, he had no checks to his power, he was beholden to no one.  Light disregards due process. The world, if he remained unstopped, would have been left to his whims. A single person whims. That's not a better world. It's a tyrannical one.

 

Even if he had the moral high ground, one person having that much power is a bad thing. Okay: let's say all the criminals and dead and deserve it. All the "innocent" people are alive and happy. The problem is the line of what is wrong, immoral, or criminal can move. He could just up and decide that certain things that weren't criminal yesterday, are now punishable today. It's not a basis for an entire world to run on, it was a narcissist's delusion. 

[Clephas]

Because the government has legitimacy and the public mandate that predates its actions?  Light acts and gains something resembling a public mandate (though not really).  However, the fact remains that the government's continued existence is reliant on a social contract that basically states 'well, we might not like you, but it's better than barbarism'. 

 

Edit:  Incidentally, that social contract does break down if the government abuses that mandate, such as by utilizing summary executions, internal military intervention, etc.  One of the reasons China has so much trouble is that while it has a strong social contract with the Han portion of the population, it failed to form one with the other parts of its population, lol. 

 

Anyway, let's stop derailing this topic (suggest to mods that we separate this into a 'villains, heroes, and the moral and political right' thread and the pre-existing 'list your favorite villains' thread).

[Okami]

Do the ends justify the means... depends on your outlook.  I don't believe in absolute morality (since morality is fundamentally subjective), so I tend to lean toward yes... but in the end, you can argue either way and reach a 'right' answer.  Villains are relative, as well... I mean, Reinhardt's idea of a new world in Dies Irae was a hell from many (most, since it was basically a Darwinian Valhalla) people's perspective, but from the perspective of many of those who followed him, it was an idea that represented an ideal world.  From the point of view of Schreiber or Wilhelm, he was the ultimate good, lol.

[Pantsu]

No love for Monster's Johan Liebert :C

[nohman]

No love for Monster's Johan Liebert :C

[Fiddle]

Because this is in General Discussion rather than Anime/Manga Talk, I'd like to take this opportunity to express my nonpareil love for Skeletor as a villain. Truly, I need not say more about his superiority, for it manifests itself within each and every one of his appearances. Take note, pseudo-villains:

 

[BookwormOtaku]

Is it a coincidence this thread's created while Extra Credits is doing this?

[Funyarinpa]

On another hand, I think the best/most terrifying villain is one you can relate with.

 

And based on that, and also seeing how many different viewpoints about the character there can be, I think Light Yagami is a great villain.

[Pantsu]

Oh man, how could I forget him? I even picked him as one of my cards in the ongoing Battle of the Guilds. He's a good choice.