Help in learning Japanese (when you are stuck)

[Okami]

I am probably not the only one around hire learning Japanese so I thought it would be useful to have a topic where you can ask for help when you are stuck and can't figure out something.

 

Now the thing that I can't figure out for some time is gramar about numbers. I am using Roseta stone to learn Japanese and I have passed the part where you learn basic numbers, but the only thing that I figured out about gramar when using numbers is that when you add extension "sai" to number that means that that number stand for telling you in which order is something (like first, second...) but the rest of it I failed to understand especially when it comes to numbers one and two that it seems have some special rules to them in most cases.

 

I know it is not a big thing but it bothers me that no mater how much I look into it I always fail to figure it out, so I will be very grateful to anyone who explain me this.

[Yeah Way]

I am probably not the only one around hire learning Japanese so I thought it would be useful to have a topic where you can ask for help when you are stuck and can't figure out something.

 

Now the thing that I can't figure out for some time is gramar about numbers. I am using Roseta stone to learn Japanese and I have passed the part where you learn basic numbers, but the only thing that I figured out about gramar when using numbers is that when you add extension "sai" to number that means that that number stand for telling you in which order is something (like first, second...) but the rest of it I failed to understand especially when it comes to numbers one and two that it seems have some special rules to them in most cases.

 

I know it is not a big thing but it bothers me that no mater how much I look into it I always fail to figure it out, so I will be very grateful to anyone who explain me this.

There aren't many grammatical rules regarding numbers, really. I assume that when thou sayest 1 & 2 are irregular, thou meanest the words "Hitori" and "Futari": other than that, all of which thou hast to  be aware is the switch between "Kun" and "On" reading with dates. Numbering nouns is just as straightforward as in English.

[Yeah Way]

By the way, thou shouldst definitely take a look at the JP discussion thred: it'd be nice if we could get that back on its hind legs.

[solidbatman]

There is a thread, here that might help.

Edited September 22, 2013 by solidbatman

[Zakamutt]

Check out "counting words" from here for something brief: http://amaterasu.tindabox.net/guide/Vocab.php

[Okami]

Yeah Way  When I said that 1 & 2 are irregular I mean about how the 1 changes from ichi to ikko or ippo and 2 from ni to futari as other numbers don't change when you are numbering they only have different extension like "hiki" "hon" "dai" "sai" "biki".  But when it comes to those extension I don't really get them either, I mean look in those 4 sentences:

Inu ga nihiki

Pen ga nihon

Neko ga sanbiki

Kuruma ga ichidai

 

They are all used to refer to how much of something is there but all of them have different extension on numbers and I don't get why.

 

solidbatman I already know about that topic but I didn't find anything about my problem there and it looks to me that people there are talking about more advance Japanese as translating more complex sentences and learning Kanji so I didn't thought that I should ask  about my problem there.

 

Zakamutt I didn't yet fully mastered Hiragana so i might be reading it wrong but if I am not then I don't think that this is what I was referring to.

[shcboomer]

That is one of those things about Japanese, counters are a pain and require memorization. To be honest, the best suggestion is just to try memorizing them. It only gets more confusing with the different counters on the varying extensions/counters. I guess the easiest way to think of it is that the numbering system for 1 and 2 changes for each type of counter, no real use trying to understand why, but it is probably more effective knowing what/when to use which counters and how to count them off.

[garejei]

Yeah Way  When I said that 1 & 2 are irregular I mean about how the 1 changes from ichi to ikko or ippo and 2 from ni to futari as other numbers don't change when you are numbering they only have different extension like "hiki" "hon" "dai" "sai" "biki".  But when it comes to those extension I don't really get them either, I mean look in those 4 sentences:

Inu ga nihiki

Pen ga nihon

Neko ga sanbiki

Kuruma ga ichidai

 

They are all used to refer to how much of something is there but all of them have different extension on numbers and I don't get why.

 

 

Because there's a different counter for different things, you just gotta memorize them all with all the irregularities:

 

http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/complete/counting

 

nihiki because hiki is the counter for small animals, and the dog is a small animal.

nihon because hon is the coutner for long, cylindrical things, and a pen is one such thing.

sanbiki because the h in hiki becomes a b with three (san), it's the rule.

ichidai because dai is the counter for vehicles, including cars.

[Okami]

Garage Thanks I understand it now, I would never manage to guess that this was the case on my own.