Visual Novel Writers You Hate?

[sanahtlig]

Writing is a method of conveying information.  If the information being conveyed is worthless, it really doesn't matter how it's conveyed.  The base information--the content--is what matters.  The method of conveying the information--writing style--is of secondary importance.  You're right--the original writing style can't be evaluated via translation, no matter how accurate the translation might be.  The content can.  I evaluate writers primarily by content, not style.

[Pabloc]

You're right--the original writing style can't be evaluated via translation, no matter how accurate the translation might be.  The content can.  I evaluate writers primarily by content, not style.

That's true for actually translated VNs - most translations are decent enough to at least convey the plot (except for blatant trolling like Flyable Heart, obviously).

With machine translators, not only you can't evaluate the style, but you have absolutely no idea about the content as well. You are just piecing random words together and deluding yourself that the result is somehow related with the original work. Hint - it isn't.

 

At first, I also wanted to mention that style isn't very important only in something like a manual for a vacuum cleaner, while in literature it does matter a lot and can be much more important than the content in some cases... But , I guess there's no point. If you can tolerate MT's random gibberish, you must be completely desensitized to writing styles in general.

[sanahtlig]

That's true for actually translated VNs - most translations are decent enough to at least convey the plot (except for blatant trolling like Flyable Heart, obviously).

With machine translators, not only you can't evaluate the style, but you have absolutely no idea about the content as well. You are just piecing random words together and deluding yourself that the result is somehow related with the original work. Hint - it isn't.

You're still insisting that machine translation is completely incomprehensible.  I'm not sure how to beat this out of your head without resorting to ridiculous demonstrations of proof that aren't worth either of our time.  Suffice to say, I can read Japanese walkthroughs and follow them to the expected result.  I can play games with complex mechanics explained in Japanese (e.g., Softhouse Chara titles) and succeed.  I can summarize and describe scenes from the types of games I like to play that I've read via machine translation.  I've translated the cryptic opening scene from Dark Blue (using the full battery of tools at my disposal), shown it to a friend who has more advanced knowledge in the language, and was told it was basically accurate.

 

I know some Japanese now and it's a useful supplement to machine translation.  It is however entirely possible to play a game via machine translation and achieve comprehension approaching that of a native reader.  I went back and played Duel Savior in English years after I'd played it via machine translation--the experience was not radically different.  I expect the result would be no different if I replayed Kamidori Alchemy Meister.

[Pabloc]

@Sanahtlig

Ok, machine translation can resemble somewhat comprehensible text. Sometimes. And you probably can do the most basic stuff while relying on it (using walkthroughs etc.). With the aid of visuals and voices, you could probably get the gist of the plot even without any translation to begin with. Also, VN-hybrids with gameplay are often rather dialogue-heavy - MTs usually handle those slightly less awfully than solid narrative. And once you familiarize yourself with common game vocab, gameplay is generally manageable.

 

But, all that stuff is on a completely different level than what you need to even think of evaluating the writers.

 

@Palas

Oh, Ulysses... One of the very few books that I never managed to finish. >_<

But yeah, you are right. Even if a VN is somewhat poorly written, it can make up for it with other features, so the style is generally less important than in the case of books. Though there are exceptions of course - for example, from what I heard, Kazoku Keikaku is made of writing style, not content (and apparently everything was lost in the TLed version).

[sanahtlig]

VN-hybrids with gameplay are often rather dialogue-heavy - MTs usually handle those slightly less awfully than solid narrative. 

My experience is the opposite.  Dialogue machine translates poorly.  Narrative machine translates more accurately because it's often written in a more formal style.  There are exceptions such as Amatsukaze where the narrative descriptions often ended up as complete gibberish.  Coincidentally, dialogue tends to be easier for language students to translate than narrative, leading to synergy when machine translation tools are paired with basic language knowledge.

[Vokoca]

I concur. Jack Kerouac and James Joyce are, what? 90, 95% style? If you could quantify such a thing, their figures would be somewhere around these numbers I guess. Still, this is normally not the case for visual novels as far as I'm concerned as you have the art and the gameplay and the music and the interface to support that department.

There are quite notable exceptions to this, though - in fact, I might go as far as to say that the whole chuuni genre relies heavily on its writing style. Sure, you will always get the story with the translation, but with chuuni, I feel like you're only getting its core, without all the flavour and smaller details. Sadly, this is not even the fault of translators, because no matter how good they are, there are some things that will just never work outside of Japanese - like playing with kanji and their meanings/readings, which can surprisingly enough add much more depth to the text itself.

[Christfall]

Tanaka Romeo (Rewrite, Cross Channel), I almost felt asleep in Akane route and Terra route, that's how his writing is capable of doing to me.

 

And recently, Niijima Yuu. I felt being trolled/insulted after reading Majokoi as a VN gamer.

[Zakamutt]

^people claim Romeo didn't really write in his usual style in Rewrite fwiw

[Nerathim]

^people claim Romeo didn't really write in his usual style in Rewrite fwiw

 

That's for the best (from my perspective). Not that Romeo's writing style is bad but all of his VNs aren't really well translated and the cause could be his usual style. In the japanese version of Rewrite it's a pity given the amazing reputation of Romeo but at least we can read something understandable in english this time.