What makes Grisaia no Kajitsu so great?

[storyteller]

Yeah, one of the things you always hear about when it comes to Michiru is that "premise so bad, they had to retcon her".
Once again, I'll offer the other side of the argument that 1) I myself never saw any retcon and 2) no one discussing the game in Japanese seem to ever mention there being a retcon.

[Eclipsed]

Retconned Michiru is best Michiru

I feel like watching Meikyuu and Rakuen anime adaptations, though unlike Little Busters EX! adaption which I got a lot of flak for cuz 'y ruin da exp when u can wait until 30XX for the translation VN to come out', Meikyuu and Rakuen will come out someday(?) and LB was 4/10 anyway

And the first Grisaia adaptation was a disaster so nevermind I take back everything.

[Deep Blue]

michiru best girl  to be honest and this i'm sure was already said many times on this thread, the problem with grisaia is that it doesnt take stance, it is not a sci-fi and not a realist vn either, sometimes it tries to be both and maybe that's why some people dislike the novel and the plot, I think that once you start reading it you shouldnt take it very serious and read it for what it is, a vn that tries to tell an story for each girl and nothing more, have fun a that time and move on  

[storyteller]

My problem here is that no one seems to ever go into detail regarding the retcon. It all ways seems to be "there was a retcon, thus it sucked", and never says where the retcon happened. I would read over the whole of Meikyuu and Rakuen again to check, but I don't have the games on me right now O_o

[Deep Blue]

My problem here is that no one seems to ever go into detail regarding the retcon. It all ways seems to be "there was a retcon, thus it sucked", and never says where the retcon happened. I would read over the whole of Meikyuu and Rakuen again to check, but I don't have the games on me right now O_o

what the heck is retcon   

[Maxel]

What makes this VN so great? Let me answer this question.

It's the characters, each and every heroine, and I would say support characters like JB and our MC Yuuji too. While story isn't mindblowing, characters are definitely the strongest point of Grisaia no Kaijutsu. 

Yumiko 4 life!

Edited November 16, 2015 by Maxel

[VirginSmasher]

Definitely the characters and character development. It's not often that a visual novel can make me care about all the heroines. Some come close to it, but there are few I've played that do that.

[monkeysrumble]

Personally for me what makes Grisaia such an enjoyable read isn't only just the characters but how different every characters route was in their style of writing.

what the heck is retcon   

Basically taking a plot point and changing it in a sequel.

[minuore]

What made me skim through this thread is because I have the same opinion as the OP. Love Rewrite a lot and don't get the idea why Grisaia is popular.

However, my take on such comparisons always end up with "don't compare 2 different stories with different genre or aim of the author". Example how I hear others talk about Log Horizon compared to SAO. (I enjoyed Log Horizon too as it introduced interesting and new MMO mechanics.)

Deviate from topic and just to leave my thoughts here;

My question is how long stories bore me like Irotoridori no Sekai and Grisaia, are people rating it for the overall or because there are interesting plots?

 

If for 'overall', the jokes and stuff that, common routes mainly composed of, almost made me dropped Irotoridori(took me long to complete). I tried to rate it for the main route or else it might just be at average, skipped Tsukasa's route, skimmed through others except Kana as it is my first route. Any reason why Favorite makes their CG and quality so low? Quality wise AstralAir seems to be the same deal.

 

I might be drawing a lot of hate but I really am curious if anyone have time to even give me answers. The reason I did not use Grisaia was the fact that I watched the anime first instead of the VN. It affects my opinion like how Clannad did. Little Busters was the opposite and that's why I truly appreciated the VN than the anime. Rewrite was so enjoyable it took me 2.5 weeks to finish it.(maybe it is the mini maps' and side jokes' fault, haha). While Grisaia took me less than a week, add-in the fact I was done with and enjoyed the anime whilst some ending differs. Still Rewrite made me want to reread it again.

 

I think I enjoy medium length VN more like Alcot Honey Comb's, Shinigami no Kiss wa Wakare no Aji and Real Imouto ga Iru Ooizumi-kun no Baai. Do you guys also skip parts of a VN when it is too long? My practice had been to skip character routes if don't like. Or else I will hardly be able to complete some like Irotoridori. 

Though not convinced but I simply take Maxel that is a few post above me for the answer why Grisais is good, character vs the story wise. 

Edited November 16, 2015 by minuore

[Deep Blue]

Personally for me what makes Grisaia such an enjoyable read isn't only just the characters but how different every characters route was in their style of writing.

what the heck is retcon   

Basically taking a plot point and changing it in a sequel.

I see, well I haven't read the sequels and I'm sure many of the readers here on fuwa either since they are not translated... so is hard to say the plot was changed, maybe because of the anime but the anime is garbage and doesn't stay true to the first one and im sure the rest is the same so I don't know.

[VirginSmasher]

Personally for me what makes Grisaia such an enjoyable read isn't only just the characters but how different every characters route was in their style of writing.

what the heck is retcon   

Basically taking a plot point and changing it in a sequel.

I see, well I haven't read the sequels and I'm sure many of the readers her on fuwa either since they are not translated... so is hard to say the plot was changed, maybe because of the anime but the anime is garbage and doesn't stay true to the first one and im sure the rest is the same so I don't know.

True. They condensed one entire route of development into 1 episode. That made me wanna shot whoever decided that.

[MikeY91]

What I find pretty amusing about your experience is that Michiru's route seems to be pretty widely considered to be one of the worst routes in the entire VN, aside from Yumiko's, due to the bullshit pseudoscience involved, the erratic behavior of a few of the characters compared to the other routes, and the overall ridiculousness that's ever-present after the halfway point and the "big reveal".  The story of Michiru's route was actually retconned in Meikyuu, so I think that says something about the quality of the route itself, or at least the general Japanese fan reaction to it.  Amane and Sachi's routes are generally thought of as the best, with some people swapping out Sachi's for Makina's.  Would you mind explaining why you didn't like either of their routes?

i know i am in the minority regarding liking Michiru's route, i just really liked Michiru's personality, i know many people consider her to be annoying/boring but i admired the fact that she tried so hard to appear 'normal' (by using her tsundere acts etc), i also liked her back story a lot. like i said her route could have been better because:

the vn could have EASILY explained that Michiru developed another personality because of the abuse she had suffered, which is psychologically possible, but they decided to add the sci-fi part and say that she got the other personality from the new heart blah blah blah

 So yeah, Michiru was easily my favorite character. Regarding Amane and Sachi's route, i liked Amane's personality in the common route but once her route started i was a bit disappointed, first of all i did not like the fact that most of the route was a flash back of her past, i thought it was boring and they should have done it like Michiru's route where a little bit about her past is revealed then the vn goes back tp present and so on, it felt like we didn't see Amane and Yuuji interact much, also regarding the angelic howl, oh boy..too much bs was happening and in my opinion i thought it was a bit stupid.

Yuuji's sister was introduced and she was intelligent and all, the vn gives the impression that she had a plan to escape with Amane, but she never does and she only reveals the escape route to Amane before she gets killed (I don't even know if she was really killed anyhow). The whole situation after the accident was very unrealistic to be honest, they only fell from a cliff near the road but they made it seem like an impossible situation...

well for Sachi's route

I have nothing against Sachi as a character, i wouldn't say i liked her but i didn't dislike her, her back story was good as well, what made me drop this vn is when Yuuji blew up the school....that blew my mind...and not only that but apparently the principal also accepted that, and the vn made it seem like the most normal thing in the world, AND Yuuji decides that it is best to have sex with Sachi right after blowing up the school (while Sachi was literally at her emotional limit !) that did it for me, so i did not finish her route.

[minuore]

What I find pretty amusing about your experience is that Michiru's route seems to be pretty widely considered to be one of the worst routes in the entire VN, aside from Yumiko's, due to the bullshit pseudoscience involved, the erratic behavior of a few of the characters compared to the other routes, and the overall ridiculousness that's ever-present after the halfway point and the "big reveal".  The story of Michiru's route was actually retconned in Meikyuu, so I think that says something about the quality of the route itself, or at least the general Japanese fan reaction to it.  Amane and Sachi's routes are generally thought of as the best, with some people swapping out Sachi's for Makina's.  Would you mind explaining why you didn't like either of their routes?

i know i am in the minority regarding liking Michiru's route, i just really liked Michiru's personality, i know many people consider her to be annoying/boring but i admired the fact that she tried so hard to appear 'normal' (by using her tsundere acts etc), i also liked her back story a lot. like i said her route could have been better because:

Hidden Content

 So yeah, Michiru was easily my favorite character. Regarding Amane and Sachi's route, i liked Amane's personality in the common route but once her route started i was a bit disappointed, first of all i did not like the fact that most of the route was a flash back of her past, i thought it was boring and they should have done it like Michiru's route where a little bit about her past is revealed then the vn goes back tp present and so on, it felt like we didn't see Amane and Yuuji interact much, also regarding the angelic howl, oh boy..too much bs was happening and in my opinion i thought it was a bit stupid.

Hidden Content

well for Sachi's route

Hidden Content

 

I just like to say I also like Michiru. 

.

Edited November 16, 2015 by minuore
What am I saying?

[MikeY91]

I just like to say I also like Michiru. About the tsudere, she is not the kind you normally see even if classified as Modern tsundere in vndb.

Classic has been given to Yumiko I believe.

Yes Michiru is a fake tsundere and thats what made her adorable in my opinion 

[Zebhra]

Lets just all join in one big " Michiru have the best route!" club! \ /

Becase i really think her route was the bestone, romantic stuff was fitting (aside from one weird sex-scene), there actually was a development and the vox in a box was priceless too (fu anime!). The only mediocre "complain" i can give is there are no Yuji's backstory in it, all other routes told us an important part of Yuji's part, but i dont really care. I'v read Michiru after Amane and found it much more well paced and really good written.

 

And as i already said some pages ago:

Michiru = best route

Yumiko = best gurl

[monkeysrumble]

Lets just all join in one big " Michiru have the best route!" club! \ /

Someones getting the right idea.

[VirginSmasher]

What I find pretty amusing about your experience is that Michiru's route seems to be pretty widely considered to be one of the worst routes in the entire VN, aside from Yumiko's, due to the bullshit pseudoscience involved, the erratic behavior of a few of the characters compared to the other routes, and the overall ridiculousness that's ever-present after the halfway point and the "big reveal".  The story of Michiru's route was actually retconned in Meikyuu, so I think that says something about the quality of the route itself, or at least the general Japanese fan reaction to it.  Amane and Sachi's routes are generally thought of as the best, with some people swapping out Sachi's for Makina's.  Would you mind explaining why you didn't like either of their routes?

i know i am in the minority regarding liking Michiru's route, i just really liked Michiru's personality, i know many people consider her to be annoying/boring but i admired the fact that she tried so hard to appear 'normal' (by using her tsundere acts etc), i also liked her back story a lot. like i said her route could have been better because:

Hidden Content

 So yeah, Michiru was easily my favorite character. Regarding Amane and Sachi's route, i liked Amane's personality in the common route but once her route started i was a bit disappointed, first of all i did not like the fact that most of the route was a flash back of her past, i thought it was boring and they should have done it like Michiru's route where a little bit about her past is revealed then the vn goes back tp present and so on, it felt like we didn't see Amane and Yuuji interact much, also regarding the angelic howl, oh boy..too much bs was happening and in my opinion i thought it was a bit stupid.

Hidden Content

well for Sachi's route

Hidden Content

I loved Michiru's route the most cause of the character development. I didn't like her in the common route and her route managed to make me like her. That's how good it was.

[Kelebek1]

Nothing's great about it, it's just only of like 2 VNs translated into English in the past 5 years. So everyone plays it, and in comparison to these other 10 year old VNs they have to play, it seems great. Look at places like reddit's visualnovels, it's just the same 5 VNs over and over and over and over and over. With localisers only providing nukige, of course they're crying out for something non-shit.

Edited November 16, 2015 by Kelebek1

[VirginSmasher]

Nothing's great about it, it's just only of like 2 VNs translated into English in the past 5 years. So everyone plays it, and in comparison to these other 10 year old VNs they have to play, it seems great. Look at places like reddit's visualnovels, it's just the same 5 VNs over and over and over and over and over. With localisers only providing nukige, of course they're crying out for something non-shit.

I may be blinded by the fact that it was my first VN, but I love it anyways.

[Mugi]

Yumiko and Michiru's route were okay, I don't think they were as bad as most people make them out to be, but Yumiko's was certainly not as..exciting as the rest? And while Michiru's had some pretty bullshit moments logic-wise, I still think it was decent. Makina's and Sachi's routes were great imo, and Angelic Howl is borderline god tier. It's not just popular because it's one of the few TL'd VN's in the past few years, that's just silly  

[solidbatman]

Grisaia is mediocre. It has an incredible common route carried by the on point humor, and how well the characters interact, but it's character routes are horrible because it suddenly takes away its strengths to attempt to have a heavy story. It eliminates the fun comedy, and great character interaction, for inconsistent stories that end up changing a characters personality all together (biggest offender is Michiru's route in regards to Yuiji suddenly becoming a dense, cliche male VN protag instead of the smart, thoughtful, witty, character of the common) 

[Kawasumi]

unpopular opinion: the common route was too long and dragged out to the point of not being funny anymore.

[VirginSmasher]

Yumiko and Michiru's route were okay, I don't think they were as bad as most people make them out to be, but Yumiko's was certainly not as..exciting as the rest? And while Michiru's had some pretty bullshit moments logic-wise, I still think it was decent. Makina's and Sachi's routes were great imo, and Angelic Howl is borderline god tier. It's not just popular because it's one of the few TL'd VN's in the past few years, that's just silly  

I still think Yumiko is the best girl. I have a thing for Kuuderes.

 

unpopular opinion: the common route was too long and dragged out to the point of not being funny anymore.

I loved the common route, but I agree, it's too long and drags sometimes. Some scenes were still funny though.

[Maxel]

Common in Grisaia was nowhere near Majikoi for me... Damn I'll state it right here Maji's common route is the best I've ever read( I haven't read too many VNs tho) I was sad when Majikoi's common finished...

[Kawasumi]

Common in Grisaia was nowhere near Majikoi for me... Damn I'll state it right here Maji's common route is the best I've ever read( I haven't read too many VNs tho) I was sad when Majikoi's common finished...

agreed, Majikois common route is still the best for me too.