Learning Japanese - Useful resources

[Lp3]

つ (Tsu) appears a lot, but in most cases it doesn't change the pronounce of the overall sentence, can someone explain me why?

[Zakamutt]

What do you mean Oo. While it might not always be that easy to hear, つ is definitely a thing. However, the sound tends to be shortened to ts a lot (liek, for an eroge example つきみや is said more like tskimiya). If you actually mean っ, that's not tsu, that's a consonant doubling marker. なって = natte etc. If you mean using っ at the end of some random sound, that means it's emphasized / harsher somewhat like the usual voicing marks (liek, your porn doujins probably have a lot of はっ and shit.)

 

I don't actually know enough jp to know if this is 100% accurate, inb4 meph says im wrong

[Lp3]

Thanks, you actually helped even without knowing a lot of jp.

[seventhfonist425]

What do you mean Oo. While it might not always be that easy to hear, つ is definitely a thing. However, the sound tends to be shortened to ts a lot (liek, for an eroge example つきみや is said more like tskimiya). If you actually mean っ, that's not tsu, that's a consonant doubling marker. なって = natte etc. If you mean using っ at the end of some random sound, that means it's emphasized / harsher somewhat like the usual voicing marks (liek, your porn doujins probably have a lot of はっ and shit.)

 

I don't actually know enough jp to know if this is 100% accurate, inb4 meph says im wrong

 

Nah, I can confidently say this is exactly how it is. Though, I still call it "little tsu."

[zarathos_omni]

Given i study for around an hour or so during weekdays how long would it take me to learn japanese to the level where i can speak and understand. Im interested in learning japanese and plan to start from june once my exams are over but once school resumes i will be really busy. I will have to make time for learning in between my regular time for studying, watching anime and playing video games so i bet it is easy to imagine how jam packed my schedule would be. So before i start i want to be able to make a proper schedule and basically I want to get to the level speaking and understanding before i get to reading and writing. I know learning a language is a lenghty process and I could keep on learning for my entire life, but even still I would like to know how long it might take for me to get to an intermediate level atleast.

[Mephisto]

Given i study for around an hour or so during weekdays how long would it take me to learn japanese to the level where i can speak and understand. Im interested in learning japanese and plan to start from june once my exams are over but once school resumes i will be really busy. I will have to make time for learning in between my regular time for studying, watching anime and playing video games so i bet it is easy to imagine how jam packed my schedule would be. So before i start i want to be able to make a proper schedule and basically I want to get to the level speaking and understanding before i get to reading and writing. I know learning a language is a lenghty process and I could keep on learning for my entire life, but even still I would like to know how long it might take for me to get to an intermediate level atleast.

 

This really depends on how long and how diligently you practice/learn. If you spend around an hour a day, for about a week, you should be pretty solid on hirigana, and maybe have some katakana. Moving on after that really depends on how fast someone personally moves, I believe that learning the grammar and just trying to read stuff is your best bet there. 

[Chocolat]

Just find this site, I found it really useful to find kanjis, plus there's also a dictionary:

 

 

http://jisho.org/kanji/radicals/

[Chronopolis]

Given i study for around an hour or so during weekdays how long would it take me to learn japanese to the level where i can speak and understand. Im interested in learning japanese and plan to start from june once my exams are over but once school resumes i will be really busy. I will have to make time for learning in between my regular time for studying, watching anime and playing video games so i bet it is easy to imagine how jam packed my schedule would be. So before i start i want to be able to make a proper schedule and basically I want to get to the level speaking and understanding before i get to reading and writing. I know learning a language is a lenghty process and I could keep on learning for my entire life, but even still I would like to know how long it might take for me to get to an intermediate level atleast.

Just a tip, when you are starting out for hirigana and kanji, learn the correct stroke order!

 

[astro]

Just a tip, when you are starting out for hirigana and kanji, learn the correct stroke order!

Learn stroke order for the basic radicals - then you pretty much have the stroke order for every single kanji. That being said, stroke order is not terribly important and even Japanese businessmen mess up on it from time to time.

[Berilium]

EDITED

 

Feel free to remove this message.

Edited May 28, 2014 by Berilium

[HMN]

One of the books i used was called ultimate japanese:Basic-Intermediate,it has 40 lessons that takes you from the beginner level to an intermediate

the 40 lessons contains:authentic dialogues vocabulary, grammar, and usage cultural highlights

it's really good i'd recommend it if your starting out http://depositfiles.com/files/7jtd6nh8w

 

there is also a sequel advanced japanese but it only contains 15 lessons

[crunchytaco]

I want to learn Japanese so I can help translate future projects.

 

I found two books online that look like it could help out beginners.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Zero-Techniques-Students-Professionals/dp/0976998122/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1402007096&sr=8-1&keywords=learn+japanese

 

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Hiragana-Katakana-Beginners-Mastering/dp/4805311444/ref=pd_sim_b_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=1EF83AXME0N7QH3YJ3G1

 

They both look interesting and fun to learn but I'm not sure which is better.

 

How did you guys start out?

 

 

edit: Whoops, didn't realize there was a whole pinned section about this. My bad.

[dannyboo]

I want to learn Japanese so I can help translate future projects.

 

I found two books online that look like it could help out beginners.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Zero-Techniques-Students-Professionals/dp/0976998122/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1402007096&sr=8-1&keywords=learn+japanese

 

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Hiragana-Katakana-Beginners-Mastering/dp/4805311444/ref=pd_sim_b_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=1EF83AXME0N7QH3YJ3G1

 

They both look interesting and fun to learn but I'm not sure which is better.

 

How did you guys start out?

 

Just from the looks and the reviews of those two I'd definitely recommend the first one.

It is part of a series of books that will build your language step by step.

What is important is that there is an audio cd included. You need to hear how the words are pronounced.

 

 

I am learning japanese using a similar series of books which I probably can't recommend

to you since it is written in german.

Another reference for you would probably be an experienced student or a japanese person if you can find one.

I find that through Kendo (Japanese Martial Art) I get the oppertunity to find a connection between me

and japan and therefore a way to find people who can help me improve my japanese.

I've only started learning Japanese a year ago and I don't really know how it is to teach yourself

since I specifically have 90 minute lessons once a week but if you're really serious about it I strongly

suggest you find somebody who is starting out too. You can keep each other motivated and there's

also the possibility of helping each other out.

 

I'd also like to hear other people's opinions about this

[crunchytaco]

Just from the looks and the reviews of those two I'd definitely recommend the first one.

It is part of a series of books that will build your language step by step.

What is important is that there is an audio cd included. You need to hear how the words are pronounced.

 

 

I am learning japanese using a similar series of books which I probably can't recommend

to you since it is written in german.

Another reference for you would probably be an experienced student or a japanese person if you can find one.

I find that through Kendo (Japanese Martial Art) I get the oppertunity to find a connection between me

and japan and therefore a way to find people who can help me improve my japanese.

I've only started learning Japanese a year ago and I don't really know how it is to teach yourself

since I specifically have 90 minute lessons once a week but if you're really serious about it I strongly

suggest you find somebody who is starting out too. You can keep each other motivated and there's

also the possibility of helping each other out.

 

I'd also like to hear other people's opinions about this

 

Thank you for suggesting. I wouldn't say I'm confident, but I've got a grasp of how Japanese pronunciation works thanks to years of anime. Kendo is a really great idea! But Japanese people are practically non-existent where I live.  Funny you mention German, since that's another language I want to learn.

[dannyboo]

I think step by step is a good way to go

If you want to find some connections to japanese people, you don't necessarily need to do martial arts I believe.

There's also the possibility of going to the nearest japanese embassy and ask about activities that they're planning or maybe some

sort of lecture about cultural things or practically anything as long as there're going to be some japanese people.

I found that even when you think that there's no one around they start showing up once you start going to places they

would find interesting. Like, you may not find a thai in the next supermarket but you would surely find one in the next thai shop.

That sort of how it works I think.

[crunchytaco]

I think step by step is a good way to go

If you want to find some connections to japanese people, you don't necessarily need to do martial arts I believe.

There's also the possibility of going to the nearest japanese embassy and ask about activities that they're planning or maybe some

sort of lecture about cultural things or practically anything as long as there're going to be some japanese people.

I found that even when you think that there's no one around they start showing up once you start going to places they

would find interesting. Like, you may not find a thai in the next supermarket but you would surely find one in the next thai shop.

That sort of how it works I think.

 

Yeah, that makes sense. It's a little costlier investment but it's most likely worth it. I couldn't find follow ups to the second book anyway and I wanted lessons from the same author. I laid down the order a bit ago and can't wait.

 

I think I'd have some anxiety practicing my beginner's Japanese with Japanese people now that I think about it. That's pretty brave of you. On the other hand, I learned Spanish here from Spanish speakers very easily since it's densely populated by Hispanics and most jobs involve speaking to them. This part will be a bit challenging. 

[dannyboo]

I think I'd have some anxiety practicing my beginner's Japanese with Japanese people now that I think about it. That's pretty brave of you. On the other hand, I learned Spanish here from Spanish speakers very easily since it's densely populated by Hispanics and most jobs involve speaking to them. This part will be a bit challenging. 

 

In January I met some Japanese people on a training course for Kendo and there was a party on the last evening. So I sat myself into the group of japanese trying to figure out what they're saying (great practising method is just to listen) but at that point I hadn't understood most of what they said. Well, most of them spoke German as well so I asked them what they were saying and somehow they started translating for me when I needed help and when I asked a question about grammar or vocabulary questions I had they would explain it me cheerfully.

 

I really think there's nothing better than training your language with a native speaker (except for living in that country) and right now I'm upset because I didn't ask them how I could contct them..

 

Here are the links to all of the 4 books. If that's what you've been looking for.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Zero-Techniques-Students-Professionals/dp/0976998122/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1402007096&sr=8-1&keywords=learn+japanese

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Zero-Techniques-Students-Professionals/dp/0976998114/ref=pd_sim_b_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=0Q08KK54RJNMKMJJ3Y7X

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-From-Zero-Techniques-Professionals/dp/0976998130/ref=pd_sim_b_4?ie=UTF8&refRID=0Q08KK54RJNMKMJJ3Y7X

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-From-Zero-Techniques-Professionals/dp/0989654508/ref=pd_sim_b_5?ie=UTF8&refRID=0Q08KK54RJNMKMJJ3Y7X

 

However, don't go and buy them all at once. It is natural if the first one takes you a long time to finish.

I finished 3 books of the German series in one year and that's still a bit faster than expected. Maybe you will find someone to help you with your studies but even then, don't be disappointed if it takes you long to complete. I'd rather take longer to learn the whole thing than finishing it quickly and forgetting it just as fast.

[crunchytaco]

In January I met some Japanese people on a training course for Kendo and there was a party on the last evening. So I sat myself into the group of japanese trying to figure out what they're saying (great practising method is just to listen) but at that point I hadn't understood most of what they said. Well, most of them spoke German as well so I asked them what they were saying and somehow they started translating for me when I needed help and when I asked a question about grammar or vocabulary questions I had they would explain it me cheerfully.

 

I really think there's nothing better than training your language with a native speaker (except for living in that country) and right now I'm upset because I didn't ask them how I could contct them..

 

Here are the links to all of the 4 books. If that's what you've been looking for.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Zero-Techniques-Students-Professionals/dp/0976998122/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1402007096&sr=8-1&keywords=learn+japanese

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Zero-Techniques-Students-Professionals/dp/0976998114/ref=pd_sim_b_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=0Q08KK54RJNMKMJJ3Y7X

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-From-Zero-Techniques-Professionals/dp/0976998130/ref=pd_sim_b_4?ie=UTF8&refRID=0Q08KK54RJNMKMJJ3Y7X

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-From-Zero-Techniques-Professionals/dp/0989654508/ref=pd_sim_b_5?ie=UTF8&refRID=0Q08KK54RJNMKMJJ3Y7X

 

However, don't go and buy them all at once. It is natural if the first one takes you a long time to finish.

I finished 3 books of the German series in one year and that's still a bit faster than expected. Maybe you will find someone to help you with your studies but even then, don't be disappointed if it takes you long to complete. I'd rather take longer to learn the whole thing than finishing it quickly and forgetting it just as fast.

 

Hmm, slip into a party. Infiltrate and learn. I like that. 

 

And yea no way I'm going to rush this one. I have a lot of free time right now. Thank you . 

[crunchytaco]

I got the book and did my first Japanese lesson today!

 

I'm happy to say It was really easy to understand, especially the counting system. I can count to 9999 now.  

Although I'm tripping over a few things, because I know three other languages. Right now I'm trying to visualize everything in Japanese without getting crossovers coming through my head.

[dannyboo]

Unless you're learning taiwanese or something you shouldn't get too confused. A good starting point is of course to learn

all the hiragana and preferably katakana. I assume the book uses Romaji to teach you right?

 

If so, you could probably practise the hiragana by writing the appropriate ones above the Romaji. (That's just one way to do it of course)

 

And like always, you can ask lots of questions, not just me but anybody on this forum

[crunchytaco]

Yeah, I'm just starting out with my baby steps right now. I can't wait till the book starts phasing words out with Hiragana. I'll look forward to asking questions in the future . 

[dannyboo]

Feel free to do so. It also helps me when I'm answering questions because I'll internalize it better that way.

[Cyrillej1]

I want to learn Japanese so I can help translate future projects.

 

I found two books online that look like it could help out beginners.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Zero-Techniques-Students-Professionals/dp/0976998122/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1402007096&sr=8-1&keywords=learn+japanese

 

http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Hiragana-Katakana-Beginners-Mastering/dp/4805311444/ref=pd_sim_b_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=1EF83AXME0N7QH3YJ3G1

 

They both look interesting and fun to learn but I'm not sure which is better.

 

How did you guys start out?

 

 

edit: Whoops, didn't realize there was a whole pinned section about this. My bad.

 

I started out trying to self-study.. bought myself these books book (Genki I & Genki II) -holy crap they are so cheap now  -

I didn't go through it all, but the layout was easy to understand and gave me a basic understanding... I personally think they are pretty good. It starts with a simple story/dialogue, then a list of vocabulary, and grammar points that were used. Once you learn the grammar/vocabulary, you can reread the story and it will make sense if you learned it correctly. There are a few kanji in the back of the book that you can learn, but there is Furigana to help if you haven't learned them yet.  Each section will also have practice sections.  The only problem I think is that the grammar examples may be very limited (sometimes only 1 or 2 sentence example on how to use them).

 

Later on, I did take an actual class in Basic/Elementary Japanese during college.. the books we used were (Nakama 1a\1b & Nakama 2). I realized my self-study wasn't sufficient enough in my speaking. So I highly recommend that if you self-study, at least have a native japanese speaker to correct your speech and practice with, or listen to audio CDs of how things are supposed to be said. That kind of stuff can be hard to pick up if just solely relying on reading the grammar book.  I think the Nakama series was a bit more complicated to learn from, especially without an instructor to explain but it seemed to have more examples. The setup layout was similar to the Genki series.

 

Note: from my experience taking a japanese class will not automatically make you become good at speaking/reading once you complete the class. If you want to get good, a lot of time you will have to study on your own, especially the Kanji if you want to be able to read. They go over it in class but not in detail.  The class mostly helped me practice speaking, and use correct grammar when talking with others. It was helpful to have someone correct me when I used/said something wrong. But as far as reading with kanji well & methods on how to memorize them, that's mostly something you have to work on yourself.

 

The Anki flashcards really helped me personally when studying Kanji. I made up little stories for each Kanji, sometimes making them really ridiculous so I could remember them. Just have to find your own way to help review Kanji. I found it best to learn vocabulary along with a new Kanji, instead of learning them on their own. And if you've built up on Kanji, you'll start to notice how much easier it can be to memorize vocabulary (won't seem like bunch of mumbo jumbo all sounding alike anymore). So by learning Kanji, it'll definitely help learn some vocabulary and retain its meaning (even ones you haven't seen before).

 

uhh.. sorry if that was long. Just wanted to give an idea of how I personally started if it could help. I think the Genki Books would be good for a beginner (there is about ~400 kanji that can be learned from the Genki series).. I've also heard good things about the Elementary Dictionary Grammar book (but haven't used it personally). I definitely recommend using Anki for review since it helps keep all your cards organized (it will grow huge).  Oh as for a Kanji book, I recently found the Kodansha Kanji Learner's Dictionary .. and it's very nice.  Has all the jouyou kanji in it as well as many vocabulary examples, and no romanji.  Those Japanese books can get pricey though..  So here's also a free site with grammar lessons which seems quite popular - Tae-Kim's Grammar Guide. 

[zoom909]

Yeah, the Japanese books you mentioned are somewhat pricey, but they might be useful once someone is no longer a beginner.  Some people might be content to just pick up everything from reading, but others might not be satisfied with "probably got it right" and want to be proactive, and in that case I think they will benefit from careful study of the Handbook of Japanese Grammar / KLD books.

[crunchytaco]

I have my first newbie question:

 

In the book Japanese from Zero volume 1, I'm learning in this chapter the grammatical usage of wa, nan, desu, ka and along with the usage of dore, docchi, kore, sore, are (and their docchi counterparts).

 

It suddenly asks me to translate this sentence into English: Kuruma wa desu ka. 

 

Up until now I haven't seen any examples of something this abrupt. I looked up google examples for "topic + wa desu ka" of it's usage but no luck. All I can think of is this translation: The car? Feels like something is missing.

 

Am I right? Or is this a typo (this book is known for having a lot of minor typos)