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What if I hate stories and hate hentai scenes?

If you are reading VNs for H-scenes, you are a nukigamer, though you probably don't want to admit it - unless you are as open as Steve is. If you believe that h-scenes ruin VNs, you probably shouldn't be involved with otakudom at all. The proper answer is 'h-scenes are the frosting on cake and the mold on bread'. A proper VN-reader shouldn't consider them to be important either way, as h-scenes at best are no better than frosting on a cake and at worst, mold on otherwise edible bread. Edit: I know that first paragraph sounds pretty... assholish? However, it is a fact that if you are placing too much importance on the existence of or non-existence of h-scenes in VNs, you are probably way too far to one side or the other. Sometimes I want to play a VN with no sexual focus, like Tokyo Babel, and at others, I feel like something with an ecchi atmosphere, such as Erect. However, regardless of how I feel at a given moment, I don't place any significant interest in the existence of h-scenes. Edit2: To be honest, I don't like seeing this ancient debate getting revived at all. Tay already made a similar thread last year, and it was argued to death, so seeing this argument resurrected is rather unpleasant.

Reposted from: http://visualnovelaer.fuwanovel.net/2014/12/blog-changes-new-look-new-editor/ Hello everybody, If you’re reading this on the web (as opposed to the email notification you get with each post), you’ll no doubt have noticed that the blog has undergone a radical makeover! We’re trying out this new look and would love to get feedback/impressions from those of you who regularly read our content. And while the cosmetic changes are long-overdue, they’re only a small piece of the blog overhaul, and I’m pleased to give you a little insight into what’s changed. First and foremost, I would like to announce that Zakamutt has been chosen to become the official editor-in-chief over the blog. Many of you know that he has been carrying the torch for the past many months (his TL updates and project recruitment posts have been extremely popular and useful to the VN community, and his articles have made for excellent reading), but what you might not know is that in that time he’s also developed a gut feeling and vision for how to carry the blog forward. He’s a talented writer and he’s got a lot of good ideas, and I’d like to congratulate him and wish him good luck. There are several additional and substantial changes coming to the blog. I’ll endeavor to highlight a few: The blog is going to be rebranded into the “Fuwanovel Gazette”. There will be a subdomain change in the coming days (don’t worry, the old subdomain will forward you to the right place) to follow the new name, but that’s not at the top of our priorities atm A big, new focus is the variety of categories on the blog (News, Project Updates, Project Recruitment, New Releases, Fuwanovel Community, Recognition, with other categories such as “reviews” soon to follow). The categories are important because we plan on opening the blog to a much wider range of people. Project managers on TL teams, for example, will be able to directly write their own status updates/requests for new team members. Fuwanovel community members will be able to directly write up notices and updates for when new podcasts are released or community events are planned (such as when we need to party like it’s 1999). One really important and exciting change will be the implementation of a recognition program wherein we try to better highlight the awesome and interesting people, projects and discussions going on in our community and within the VN world Zaka will be sharing more information soon about how people can participate on the blog. For now, however, if anybody’s interested in writing a post (we’re interested in writers doing lots of different kinds of pieces, such as posts on translation, OELVNs, tutorials, Otome/BL, news, reviews, analysis or broader opinion pieces), keep an eye on the blog feed and the forums for more information The FuwaReviews team will be partially implemented into the blog in the coming weeks. More info about this will be coming soon Thanks again for sticking with us and keeping up with the blog. I look forward to feedback, and I look forward to Zaka continuing to impress us ; P. All the best, Tay

Here we go with the "you're a pervert, I'm not" thing again...

Then fucking leave. You literally are the cause of most of these discussion threads being closed because you refuse to accept the fact other people think differently than you. If you would just be slightly more open minded, and maybe realize your way isnt the only correct way and your beliefs are not the only correct beliefs, maybe you'd be taken a little more seriously, and wonder less what Fuwa has become. Because fuwa has always been like this. You just want to play the part of victim

I wasn't going to post, but I just can't handle those arguments anymore. I have to admit that I haven't laughed this much in quite a while.

Okay people, I know this is a hard sell since this is the internet, but can we steer this conversation away from the toxic turn it has taken? This is obviously an area of great contention, meaning it is a worthwhile discussion topic. HOWEVER, wouldn't it be better to talk about h-scenes in context of the industry, how they're used and misused, and our personal feelings on them without derisively calling each others perverts and otherwise continuing to flog a dead horse? At some point (lol not really, I know), you've just got to concede that your opinions diverge and that nothing productive will happen if you continue with specific threads of the conversation.

>Ask for the discussion to stay civil >Starts out by saying that H-scenes are an atrocity meph_says_gg_topkek_10/10_10h.mp3 In terms of purely narrative value, implied sex or explicit sex are the exact same. Their presence may or may not emphasize the fact, but I don't find that extremely important - I ctrl through them anyway so it doesn't matter. I have to disagree with your statement though. Eroge ARE for the most part hentai games, I don't give a flying damn about being called a "hentai gamer" and I don't think the presence of sex scenes does the medium any bad per se. If there is a problem with this media, it's its niche nature and the extreme exigence of its players about trivial details - mandatory voice acting, mandatory routes for everyone, mandatory archetypes, mandatory sex scenes too but that's only a consequence.

I'm sorry, but at this point I'll just go ahead and call tl;dr (I usually don't post if I haven't read the OP). Please, reflect on this article's point #5. And no, I don't think the Christmas exception really works out at this point...

Sure, let's give it a whirl. You might want to start prepping a new list of Mods however because this will probably be what happens to most of us.

I should probably add to this thread rather than just posting pointless stuff, so here goes. In that sense, h-scenes definitely have a negative effect on VNs - though I still wouldn't call it an one-sided negative effect. I agree with Zeno's idea of a 'mixed influence' in the way that the negative influence affects generally people outside of the niche group - not so much the ones inside of it, where you could argue it even has positive effects. It's also probably unfair to blame the difficult approachability on h-content alone. People will find it weird for being Japanese already; the culture is different, with different standards and measures, and even if I take the erotic content out of the quesiton completely, I still think the general public will find it repulsive in one way or the other. In this way, perhaps the general public is to blame, not the medium itself? I would also like to mention that judging h-scenes as a whole just on the bad examples (even if they are in the majority) is rather unfortunate. Sure, there are lots of VNs that have h-scenes just to fap, and there are story driven VNs with h-scenes shoehorned in so badly that they could do without them just fine - but there also exists VNs where the h-scenes are a very important, if not an integral part of the story/mechanics. Even if I disqualify euphoria for being a nukige through and through, there are other examples, like Subarashiki Hibi (where the h-scenes are used to portray just how crazy and bad things can get), Kimi to Kanojo to Kanojo no Koi (where the h-scenes are an integral plot/concept point), or even the much more familiar Saya no Uta, which I would honestly rather read with the h content than without, too. And just to make this clear, I am not a huge fan of h-scenes. I don't fap to them, and I generally have to fight the urge to skip them (and I sometimes do) - but I've learned that sometimes they just are good. Sometimes, they are just as important as the story itself. And even if they are complete trash shoehorned in just for the faps and cash-- if you got this far into eroge, which make up the majority of VNs, screaming about how inappropriate they are seems kind of silly to me. Also, let's be fair here, just as much as some people would like to deny it, visual novels aren't the only medium depicting sex out there. There are plenty of books, movies or even shows - and lots of those happen to be popular. I wonder why it's okay there, but not in VNs?

Confession : i'm building a fuwArmy, that's why i'm giving FuWeapons to everyone.

I'm just going to leave these here and slowly walk away (This will be a long long post be ready) NOW WINTER CHRISTMAS STUFF >.< AND SOME MORE AWESOME STUFF

Hmm, the actual topic is interesting so I'll just plow on ahead. Why do nukiges exist? -fappers may prefer the text + voice + sprite/cg interface of visual novels as it is more immersive. -the long play time gives a chance for the fapper to grow attached the the characters, resulting in a different experience. -a few people play nukige (mostly?) for entertainment value, but that's beyond the point Why do people (still) play all-ages nakige/charage-VN's? -they enjoy becoming attached to and spending time with the characters Why developers explicitly include H-scenes in non-nukige games? -some of the people who enjoy becoming attached to the characters now would like H-scenes with their herione. I mean doujinshi (derivative) porn is practically the same concept. -for people who bought the story and get bored of it and are still interested in random porn, they are included anyways. What if most VN's didn't have H-scenes? We'd have a lot more resources to devote to CG's. Imo, that wouldn't improve VN's THAT much, unless artistic directing improved as well. Well, it would certainly allow for scenarios and settings which are more CG-demanding. That's actually pretty important and a shame. In terms of the western market, it would definitely increase the marketability of these games. But many of the people interested in VN's still do so because they enjoy becoming attached the heriones, and as the TL'd hentai/doujinshi industry and manga gamer's finances show, the western fandom is no less horny than our Japanese counterparts. It's hard to speak generally, but if a VN wanted to use an H-scene for development purposes, there would be no need to include them on the other herione routes. Now, since a quota is demanded, I suppose writers will incoporate them as best as they can, to the point where the fact that the two characters have sex isn't as disruptive to the story as the fact that the VN explicitly shows the scene, for the purpose of titillation. Honestly, for this, the skip button. If you are purely talking about immersion and not outrage at the existence of fan-service in this world, 8 seconds of skip isn't bad. Now, for the topic I actually wanted to talk about: https://forums.fuwanovel.net/index.php?/topic/7578-idealizationappeal-of-heriones-in-vns/

Ah I see. When presented with counter evidence all you can do is close your eyes, cover your ears, and yell lala. One who is an adult and mature enough to understand that sex is both an accepted and important part of life. And who defines "pure love story" as including the lovers having sex. There's a reason why how often/good the sex is a question in marriage counseling: It's actually important. But if you want to call people like Maeda Jun, the TetraScope team, and I perverts, go right ahead. Seriously we have tonnes of creators of non-18+ stuff making 18+ doujin of their own creation. Why's it so hard to accept creators of actual 18+ content actually did it themselves? "How dare you defile my waifu". Lol

So this thread has now devolved to Okami labelling everyone who disagrees with him as perverts. Cool.

Okami. VNs are generally considered differently over there than they are here. It is true that in almost all areas - except MMORPGs - consoles beat out PC gaming over there. Not only that, but most gamers are on portables, which is why the Vita isn't dead. First, it would be more appropriate to say the existence of sexual content hurts VN sales over here, not in Japan. Second, there are precisely two major VN studios that do almost-exclusively unique non-ero VNs over there that aren't Otome game companies (better than nine out of ten otome-ge being non-ero). Those two are 5pb (associate of Nitro+ that did Chaos;Head and Steins;Gate), and Visual Arts (owns the Key brand). The rest are usually anime and normal video game derivative VNs (example: official Oreimo VN). Third, VNs are played primarily on the PC over there, consoles being preferred for 'normal' gaming, such as shooters, sports, and rpgs. Better than ninety out of every hundred VNs are produced on PC and their sales almost always (outside of the works by the two companies above) outstripped by the cream of the PC crop. To be blunt, VNs are only barely considered to be games at all, and because they are mostly seen as a 'sit down and play' genre/medium, they are generally relegated to PC as a result. Portables, which make up the largest portion of the gaming market over there, generally only receive those anime-derivatives and the occasional conversion or port. There is a market over there for the non-ero romantic games(galge), but generally the people playing those make the 'transition' to the ero ones if they don't drop it altogether before they hit 18 or their parents give permission (if they wait for permission *smiles dryly*). As my friend once explained it to me 'eroge are safe, porn is dangerous'. エロゲーは安全だけど、ポルノはけっこうヤバイよ。　 I should also add that ero-content hurting sales over here is relative and also a recent development (as in the last two or three years) because it limits who it can be sold to too much. Until relatively recently, nukige made up most of the imported VNs and almost all of the sales. Edit: Also, stop looking for global absolutes when it comes for gaming preferences. They don't exist. If they did, the US VN market would be as glutted as the one over there. Edit2: Oh, I'm not posting in this thread or even going to look at it again. Being the つっこみやく　to Okami's ぼけやく　is a lot more tiring than I thought it would be.

I think this is a fantastic idea actually. Too often I've wondered if I should hate someone and I didn't want to put in the effort to read their posts to find out if my hate was justified. This will save me a ton of time and allow me to properly target those that disagree with me. Okami, you are a fucking genius.

Well, that was predictable. I'm just amazed we made it to page 2 before Okami started calling everyone perverts. Off- topic... but aren't you supposed to throw out bread if there's any mold you can see, since the roots go deeper than the visible part?

To everyone who is a part of Fuwanovel and its many affiliates, Greetings from Japan, and happy holidays to everyone worldwide! As I sit here in my warm room sipping a glass of hot chocolate while typing this message and listening to soothing Christmas music, I can't help but take the time to write a response to Fuwanovel in regards to the holiday season and what it means to me. As many of you are aware, certain countries around the world recently celebrated Thanksgiving last week, and seeing that I wasn't able to enjoy it with the rest of my family being all the way on the other side of the world, I missed an opportunity to give my thanks to the people and things that mean a lot to me and make a huge impact on my life. Thanksgiving is the time of year for many of us to give thanks and be grateful for the many opportunities that are tossed our way, and whether you are a religious sort or a person who tends to keep to themselves, I feel there is always something in our life we can be thankful for. That being said, I want to do a little something different with this post. Before leaving for Japan, I thanked a lot of you for being supportive and giving me an awesome website with which to be a part of, however this time around I want to thank you in a different way. I want to give thanks this holiday season by sharing in the joy of what makes this website a strong foundation for a very supportive family. Without every single member of this site actively sharing in a passionate genre that many people might think odd in the real world, there wouldn't be a place which we call home. While a lot of us have differing opinions on how this site should be run, what makes a good visual novel a masterpiece, or whether h-scenes are acceptable in a game, our driving passion as a community continues to push us forward. States of limbo, lack of progress, and endless discussion are merely parts of the process for making this website what it is today. And so, I want to stop for a moment and give thanks to the many members here on this site for doing what you do. Thank you to all the fan translators, editors, hackers, and group workers who continue to give this medium life, and who continue to make us happy every single day. To us, translating even 100 lines means the world, and without you, there would be no place to call home. Thank you to every single Japanese enthusiast who understands the language and continues to support the genre and provide us with constant assistance in learning a language that many of us believe makes these stories so much more worth it. Learning a language is never easy for a most people, and your passion and helpful advice continues to motivate us in ways you cannot imagine. Thank you to the staff of Fuwanovel who, through all the shit you get daily from hate messages to reports, continue to trudge through the mess of mud slinging and push this site in the right direction. Being a leader is not easy, and while decisions we or anyone makes are not always worth it or have repercussions later on, your continued strive to do what is right moves us along each and everyday. Thank you to the haters of Fuwanovel who continue to despise this site for what it is. While it isn't in my best interest to address this, without you, this site would not grow from its misdemeanors and strengthen itself with each new mishap. You aren't the most healthy members of Fuwanovel, but you do offer advice that on occasion helps us realize our mistakes and move forward. And finally, thank you to every single member of Fuwanovel who make this genre exactly what it should be: a place to not be afraid to share in something we are all very passionate about. Each and every single 1 of you do your best to contribute what you believe will better this website, and while a lot of the things you accomplish may go unnoticed, the things you do are in no way unappreciated. I myself thank you from the bottom of my heart for making this place so much better. We have our social cliques, but in the end as I have always stated, its the family that counts. You are all different, and you all have ways of making this place better for everyone, but in the end every single member focuses on the love of something we all enjoy. So as we come to a close at the end of the year, take a second to stop and think where you stand on this website today. Remember your 1st post, and remember how you as an individual have grown to feel at home in some way or another. With that, I say happy holidays Fuwanovel, and stay safe this season! In addition... What is Christmas without a special surprise? As Rose pointed out, what's a Ren thread without a giveaway? Well, I had originally wanted to wait a day to add this to the thread as part of a special Christmas surprise, but what the hell. Introducing: OriginalRen's Very Merry Christmas Giveaway! No tricks, no gimmicks, and no special rules for this giveaway. As part of the holiday spirit, all you need to do in order to be included in the random drawing is the following: Celebrate the holiday season by adding a "Santa hat" to your avatar. If it already contains a hat, no worries! For the remainder of the month, keep that spirit strong by making something unique and awesome Post in this thread with your new avatar and state your interest in being apart of the giveaway It's as simple as that! One lucky winner will receive a physical visual novel copy of... Clannad Video: During the cold winter nights, enjoy reading a VN that a lot of you feel has left a good impression on the community. The signups will close next week on Wednesday, December 10th @ 11:59pm JST so make sure you join as soon as possible! Happy holidays once again everyone!

Kuu's being dere interesting... Confession: I always wanted to pee out of the window once

A whole page to wish us merry xmas. Seems legit

my god... IT ALL MAKES SENSE All of the tanks...

Yeah, I was basically thinking of our old server as a car from the 1970s that was falling apart, and our new server is like a much newer, nicer car that runs much better with less problems. In theory of course.

also some info about the project history from his FB -the project founded around jan 2013 -at first, they have 2 translator, junior and senior one -from jan to may, the progress just go steadily -around may, the senior translator fall ill and temporary left the project, progress slowed -around nov 2013, the senior one, decease IRL because illness -junior one, decide to keep going with the project after his senpai's left the entire project to him -slow progress till now

Okay then. The idealization of the heroines in VNs tend to make them appear as likable as possible. Because if they aren't likable, who would play their routes, right? Now now, not all people play the routes based on the heroine's likability. Some just want to actually read what the game has prepared for them. For example, reading a route for the sake of completing a game. And there are those whose autism do not allow them to leave a VN with some routes not being read yet. I, for example. But then again, the thread's topic is about the idealization of heroines and its appeal. Personally, I wouldn't give a damn about the heroine's purity and what not. It's the story itself that counts. I don't mind having a heroine with a crooked personality, so as long as her story is enough to explain what happened to her and give us a picture of what's currently happening to her. I wouldn't even mind ugly characters. You won't really see routes for ugly characters though, since, well, who'd buy a VN with ugly characters? That's the main selling point of a VN after all. I admit to looking at the art first before deciding to read a VN. However, what matters in the long run is not the art at all but the story. Of course, we can't deny the effect of the idealization of heroines to a game's success in terms of income. A VN with good art tends to rake in a lot of money since, well, the heroines are beautiful. Since the majority of men have an acceptable amount of libido, they would generally choose to buy the VN with the better art. And of course, what better thing to do than give them perfect personalities as well! This will make the readers like the heroines, making them buy the possible fandisks as well. I just randomly assumed that. I don't have any data. But surely that should make sense. Why would you buy the fandisk if you didn't like the heroines? A reason like 'to read their epilogues' is acceptable though. As Clephas had said, this trend of making the perfect girls (lol powerpuff) is especially present in nakige/moege, both of which try to present their heroines to be as likable as possible. The only difference is that moege focuses more on "uguu~" and "kawaiiii", while nakige focuses on "omg why did this happen to the heroine she's such a good girl and yet ugh sdlsfdsifdsfdsfds" stuff. I think both are still achievable by flawed heroines though... But seeing that the main selling point of VNs are mostly the heroines, they tend to be perfect. Of course, there's always the brand name to back VNs up... Well that's it from me for now.

I can't deny the truth that H-scene has a huge impact on a VN (hell, just look at IMHHW and NekoPara, people raging all over the place about "don't buy it from Steam, get the 18+ ver" and such). But personally, I find H-scene has absolutely no value aside from fan-service and breaking my Ctrl key. So yeah, story and art aside, if I have to choose between a 18+ and an all-age VN, I will choose the all-age one right away without any hesitation.

Hmmmm, well I might as well give a word concerning the... Sidetracking this thread was fated to face. I'm saying this to everyone, not just Okami. Even before the first recognizable out-of-topic post was posted, things were already getting out of hand. I am partially responsible for this, as I did (lightly) bash H-scenes a bit in my introduction, my motive behind that was mostly for comedy, and I even made a separate post saying "ITS A JOKE", yet people kept responding, and pffffffft the amount of responses was... Disappointing. So they shared their opinion, others gave theirs, and when you start arguing over something that not only wasn't meant to be talked about here, but even in its nature isn't questionable by logic... You start missing the point. lol... I now remember when a friend of mine said "You want to stay loved on the internet? Never have an opinion! People hate opinions!" I thought he was exaggerating, yet here we are eh... Anyway, so to clear up my second point, I consider it pointless to discuss morality. Everyone has different moral codes, codes that are shaped by many things, including upbringing, faith, culture, environment, and most destructively (yet most effectively) by the media. But no one, and I mean no one bases their moral codes off of logic. Can you say that H-scenes are a good/bad thing based on logic? No, only based of the moral code you hold, and in order to question anyone else's morals, you need a very deep understanding of everything that affects your opinion, and the different opinions of everyone around you. Yet all I see going on is pre-assumptions, pre-judgments and over-all a never ending barrage of ignorance. I loath the opinions of some people over here, and I'm pretty sure a lot of people loath my opinion. Does that give either of us the right to show it? No, it doesn't. More than once, I've seen people say "you're all pervs" in both a positive and a negative light, and in both cases its not true. So please, give us a break from all the clashing opinions/blind accusations, this thread was made for the purpose of seeing what people think are the effects of H-scenes on the medium as a whole, and many have done a splendid job sharing their thoughts, that's what I want to see more of.

I didn't have a vertical picture of Rin in a Santa outfit plus, I AM a fan of things besides just Love Live, Hina from Hayate no Gotoku ranks rather high on my favorite character list on MAL. So, we can update our clients now (update through the App Store or however iOS does it) but maintenance is passing it's deadline as usual You can open the gsme, spoiler screenshot to those who haven't played JP "Added friends ranking to the event ranking page" "Changed on-screen effects for Live Shows and Live Show results screen" soooo muuuuch hyyyype Also, JP Medley Festival event details announced but I'm tired, so go here. http://www.reddit.com/r/SchoolIdolFestival/comments/2o8o1t/jp_medley_festival_round_1_bibi_third_single/

Ren... we will play after 3 hours heh! Ceris whats the deal with your avatar? Where is Rin ?!? *Shokku*

Congratulations, Zaka. There's no one else who I could see running the blog.

Fact. You keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means. Maeda Jun gave his own thoughts on what he aimed for when writing each Hscene of Tomoyo After in the visual fan book. Taking Little Busters! EX： Komari and Midori's Hscene are the traditional Key wtf bad end. Kudo's Kurugaya, first Haruka, Mio, Saya, Sasami, and Rin are normal making love between lovers. Second Haruka and Kanata add to their character and plot. Now take Sakuya 18+ version. Of 4 Hscene, 3 are plot important. And the only reason the 4th isn't is because it's tucked away in an after story. What Clephas said. Also please stop pushing your own morality onto other people. And please don't project your own values onto a people who highly prized Shunga. Sounds like sunk cost fallacy.

I think having a healthy libido is a good thing and there's nothing to be ashamed about. But I wouldn't play a VN that is only focused on H content. I'd rather just look up the scenes on an image dump for hentai or similar. But an involving VN that makes me care for its characters makes H Scenes more than just frosting on a cake. It's a thirsty requirement like when girls read a chick flick and wonder, "When will he just kiss her already?" Sure H scenes are mostly written for an audience of Otaku in mind so the standards aren't Hollywood-esque, but I like to know when our MC and our Heroine entwined with love and passion nontheless. I'm a visual person, so just imagining it alone isn't enough - hence Visual Novel. I don't know how people here can be so "chaste" about their VNs. They remind me of my parents who prefer their movies without any kissing involved. I want the WHOLE PACKAGE.

I broke my promise...let the flaming commence

I know title doesn't say much so I'll explain my idea now. If you are on fuwa for some time you are probably aware of a "3 groups" problem we have around here. I am talking about 3 groups of people who are around here for completely different reasons and who often get into unpleasant discussions. So I tough we could solve this and make a Fuwa far more plesent for everyone if we ware instead of being somewhat anonymous made it possible to label everyone with the group s/he belongs and come to agreement of generally ignoring people from other groups. It should be something visible so we can easily tell who belongs in witch group it could be that we make an option to choose from 3 groups and our name could be colored with the color of that group, or it could simply be written under the avatar in witch of the 3 groups we belong. We could also make an agreement to not post in thread that ware made by people of different groups, and if we like that thread we simply make a same thread for people of our group. I think that this could bring back a friendliness that Fuwa once had, and I think that those days we are big enough for this. I mean VNs are a big media to big for a single forum, but as it would be unreasonable to ask to separate a forum into 3 forums this is a second option. As for new members they could choose their group when they are registrating or they could be asked to choose one in a time period of 1 week after a registration in case they are not sure in witch group they belong. As for moderators, well we could make exception that moderators aren't under the 3 groups rule when they do moderators stuff. True it would still be better if each of a groups had at least 1 moderator in it then we could make so that moderator that belongs in a group is in charge for judging people from that group. Like I said this way we could make it clear who's on witch side, who is friend and who enemy and that way bring back friendliness to fuwa. So what do you all think? PS: just in case you are not sure about witch 3 groups I am talking (witch is very unlikely) here is it: 1. Perverts who are into VNs only for porn. 2. People who like stories and hate H-scenes. 3. Those in between.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-TZ8Z5S9rI

I feel like there's a deeper problem at work here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFcv5Ma8u8k

I'm a pervert who prefers story. What do?

A little different flavor: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8eB4PkCo4Lo

I agree. More interesting, I think, is the way and extent in which VN heriones are idealized.

Let's keep the discussion away from what kind of people enjoy h-content (as per the OP and to avoid beating a dead horse like was done in the other topic) and instead focus on their place and impact in VNs.

Your assumption could be valid if most VNs on sale do (or did) not have HScenes and by featuring HScenes, your game is different and will thus attract that specific group of consumers. That is clearly not the case, most commercial VN releases are R18 and buyers choose between these R18 VNs. The market is best characterized by monopolistic competition, firms sell similar products but product differentiation plays a major role in determining demand. Each game offers its own plot, art, set of characters and CVs that distinguishes itself from other games and, along with reviews and recommendations, affect the consumer's choice. Small companies do not "add" HScenes, they were meant to be part of the game to begin with, and it isn't just "little companies", the well known companies feature it too, Eushully, Alice, Akabei, N+, August, Light, etc. Take a look at the top sales from last year: All of them feature HScenes, and assuming prices are stable after first press, sales are directly proportional to revenue. I can pull out another chart that totals sales from 1996 to 2008, but the R18 VNs are still an overwhelming majority. This implies that the majority of the market demands games featuring HScenes, if not, companies would have removed them and spent the budget elsewhere to increase profitability long before now. Thus it is only natural for companies competing in this market, large or small, to include, not "add" in HScenes. Now, it could be true that, had the terrible game not included HScenes, it could do even worse. This is because we would be considering a slightly different market with consumers that either do not want or do not care about HScenes, demand in general would be lower, causing an even lower revenue than the alternative, but a bad game will do bad either way. You claimed that, in the long run, these companies would eventually self destruct but never gave a reason. I don't see why a company that makes R18 VN can only profit in the short run. Going back to the chart from 2013, Giga, August, Purple, Pulltop, Alice, these are brands that used to make and still make R18 VNs they still succeed. Over time, if releases are appealing, a small producer will gain some degree of brand loyalty and become more widely known, it can create child brands (minato carnival, pulltop latte, etc.), produce FDs for its known works (see that 大空翼), and so on. Even nukige producers that focus almost exclusively on sexual content can grow large and profit, take Softhouse, Cyclet, or Lilim as examples. So how does including HScenes lead to and what is this "extremely negative impact" you speak of? So most VN players were fooled and only started playing VNs because they did not know about the presence of R18 content? Ok, I don't know what to say here lol, this is just too ridiculous. Even if you managed to avoid all of these, you can still quit upon the first HScene. Oh but they certainly are, in terms of sales and quantity. In the end, I'm the one who doesn't know? P.S. Work on your English, it's a pain to read.

Okay, look. I personally kind of enjoy H-scenes. That doesn't mean that I think they are good for the medium as a whole. People seem to be saying that things don't need to change because they don't care what other people think; it doesn't matter if the rest of the world looks down on them and refuses to play them because you still enjoy it. I don't think it's that simple, you know? As someone who doesn't read Japanese, I would love it if more VNs got officially translated and released in English, but that's not ever going to be a common occurrence as long as most outsiders to the medium only see VNs as porn. I also would love to have conversations about VNs with people outside this bubble, but that just isn't possible for me at the moment. I would really like to recommend games like Ever 17 to members of my family, or even to friends with no context for this sort of thing, but I can't do that because if they dig even a little bit deeper into this stuff, they'll find that 90% of the genre has pornographic content in it and be upset with me for liking this form of storytelling. It's not just a matter of "I don't care what other people think." I mean, I feel like the pornographic content (or the perception that VNs exist only for such content) is keeping VNs from being popular in the west. And I would actually like this medium to thrive out here. There are some absolutely fantastic stories that have been told this way,and people are missing out.

My Asus T100TAM Visual Novel Tablet running Rewrite beautifully in low light setting. I was playing it from the ride to the Casino and back home. Picture taken with a Note 3 Samsung.

I'm really enjoying Aria, i think it's such a wonderful ride you can take slowly and never get bored of it. In fact i think it's meant to be taken slowly. I get home exhausted, tune in on Aria and it's just a moment of bliss. 10/10 would recommend. I tihnk it's impossible to give it any other rating in fact.

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God I love Robot chicken

Ancient Gay Porn

I feel bad for anime-only watchers because the character development just isn't there in this adaptation. Like the whole Everybody in general still look like they are only acquaintences of each other rather than close friends. ~~~ Only scene I was interested in seeing animated was