Sony New Censorship Of Everything

[sarkasmus]

1 minute ago, Sparteh said:

I will repost what I posted of reddit and got completely voted down. 

All VNs can be divided into 3 groups:

1. 0 h-content VNs like Steins or Umineko 
2. just a little bit extra to the story - basically majority of what we read here: Fate, Muramasa, Baldr, Silverio, Dies Irae etc.
3. full h-VNs - the group I dislike the most and find useless, but hey that is my opinion. Basically everything without any story, but pure h-scenes focus here (99% of VNs).

Ok, so first group shouldn't have any problems. Second group can be easily dealt with. We have many examples here. The problem is with the 3rd group. Those games are bought for the purpose of porn. What is the point of buying censored porn? If we talk about that white light censorship that is usually used, wouldn't it mean that customer would buy a game that is majority of time simply a white screen? It would make 3rd group worthless.

Another problem is what type of content is censored. If h-content is censored, shouldn't all games with a lot of killing be censored as well? That would make the majority of the market. If they are not censored, then we need to ask a question why sex is worse than massacre.

H-content doesn't get on consoles anyway, what they're censoring now is Fanservice.

With Sonys new policy it's likely that CGs like the shower one in Steins Gate would be censored in the same way, so even group 1 would be affected.

[Hetzer123]

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Edited October 2, 2019 by Hetzer123

[wyldstrykr]

56 minutes ago, Sparteh said:

1. full h-VNs - the group I dislike the most and find useless, but hey that is my opinion. Basically everything without any story, but pure h-scenes focus here (99% of VNs).

 

so youre saying that 1% of VNs arent porn oriented huh...

[Formlose Gestalt]

2 hours ago, Sparteh said:

All VNs can be divided into 3 groups:

1. 0 h-content VNs like Steins or Umineko 
2. just a little bit extra to the story - basically majority of what we read here: Fate, Muramasa, Baldr, Silverio, Dies Irae etc.
3. full h-VNs - the group I dislike the most and find useless, but hey that is my opinion. Basically everything without any story, but pure h-scenes focus here (99% of VNs).

Ok, so first group shouldn't have any problems. Second group can be easily dealt with. We have many examples here.

Except that Silverio Trinity is presicely one of the title that Sony got a problem with so that argument doesn't really work.

Source:

https://gematsu.com/2018/10/visual-novel-silverio-trinity-coming-to-playstation-hindered-by-recent-sony-regulations

[Narcosis]

I strongly believe this is the push the japanese game developers so much needed to finally move onto PC platform, which might also indicate a slow end to the japanese console era.

[Wildbreed]

18 hours ago, Sparteh said:

I will repost what I posted of reddit and got completely voted down. 

All VNs can be divided into 3 groups:

1. 0 h-content VNs like Steins or Umineko 
2. just a little bit extra to the story - basically majority of what we read here: Fate, Muramasa, Baldr, Silverio, Dies Irae etc.
3. full h-VNs - the group I dislike the most and find useless, but hey that is my opinion. Basically everything without any story, but pure h-scenes focus here (99% of VNs).

Ok, so first group shouldn't have any problems. Second group can be easily dealt with. We have many examples here. The problem is with the 3rd group. Those games are bought for the purpose of porn. What is the point of buying censored porn? If we talk about that white light censorship that is usually used, wouldn't it mean that customer would buy a game that is majority of time simply a white screen? It would make 3rd group worthless.

Another problem is what type of content is censored. If h-content is censored, shouldn't all games with a lot of killing be censored as well? That would make the majority of the market. If they are not censored, then we need to ask a question why sex is worse than massacre.

Man if your saying that 99 % VNs are nukige your so wrong..

So then Sanoba Witch and Maitetsu are VNs without any story since they got so many H scenes?

btw do you even know how to classify VNs into? like for eg.. moege, charage, Nakige, Utsuge and finally Nukige(Which is obviously pure h scene focused)

[r0xm2n]

Censorship is just a type of Political Correctness. Both tick me off (especially since extremely corrupt and borderline evil elements are always the ones pushing it).

Censorship and Political Correctness (for the most part) are about to go extinct though....

[littleshogun]

To find out why sex is censored while massacre isn't censored, I think it would be a lot of work to find any satisfied explanation so I wouldn't go into that (I'm sure there's a lot of material out there). Anyway, what I can say is that I guess it's up to Sony in regard of censoring their fanservice contents or not, but if they did that then perhaps it might be akin that Sony shoot their own leg because the developers wouldn't like to compromise, although perhaps there would be some company that would be willingly to compromise by Sony there such as Leaf (Presumably). If anything, at least it mean that Sony's rival would get a lot of weapon to sink Sony sales by offering the rejected companies to add the games to their own console, although it's just my conjecture anyway.

PS - I believed that Sparteh here was probably just find out that classification today (Nukige, moege, nakige, charage), and I find that it's quite understandable if Reddit shot down his post there.

Edited October 31, 2018 by littleshogun

[bakauchuujin]

1 hour ago, littleshogun said:

To find out why sex is censored while massacre isn't censored, I think it would be a lot of work to find any satisfied explanation so I wouldn't go into that (I'm sure there's a lot of material out there). Anyway, what I can say is that I guess it's up to Sony in regard of censoring their fanservice contents or not, but if they did that then perhaps it might be akin that Sony shoot their own leg because the developers wouldn't like to compromise, although perhaps there would be some company that would be willingly to compromise by Sony there such as Leaf (Presumably). If anything, at least it mean that Sony's rival would get a lot of weapon to sink Sony sales by offering the rejected companies to add the games to their own console, although it's just my conjecture anyway.

My guess would be that it is based on christianity. The religion is extreemly sexualy repressive and also contains lots of violence like God drowning almost all of life or God ordering a tribe to kill everyone in another tribe including woman and children, well unless the women are virgins in which case they can keep the women for themselves. The society having been based on these books for so long and there still being so many people who believe in them I don't really find it that odd that there are people who are totally okay with children seeing violence and murder but go into a complete fit when their children see anything remotely sexual. They don't think as rational people only thinking about the actual effects these things have on their children but rather based on what their religion tells them is bad or what society which was previously based on this says is bad.

Edited October 31, 2018 by bakauchuujin

[alpacaman]

I think it's more about traditions in Christian countries than about what the Bible says (I don't know how it is in other religions). Being opposed to free sexuality originally comes from it being an effective protection against diseases and many religions just put their spiritual justification on top of that later on, often leading to a dynamic that became more and more repressive. There just isn't a similar tradition with violence. You could even say that violence served as a means to show your manlihood despite restrictive sexual morals and many countries have an affinity to violence ingrained in their national folklore, especially the USA with its Revolutionary War and Civil War, the Wild West and so on. And with the USA still being the most important market for any kind of media it's logical that producers try to comply with US laws first.

[sarkasmus]

14 minutes ago, alpacaman said:

I think it's more about traditions in Christian countries than about what the Bible says (I don't know how it is in other religions). Being opposed to free sexuality originally comes from it being an effective protection against diseases and many religions just put their spiritual justification on top of that later on, often leading to a dynamic that became more and more repressive. There just isn't a similar tradition with violence. You could even say that violence served as a means to show your manlihood despite restrictive sexual morals and many countries have an affinity to violence ingrained in their national folklore, especially the USA with its Revolutionary War and Civil War, the Wild West and so on. And with the USA still being the most important market for any kind of media it's logical that producers try to comply with US laws first.

It's not even about laws though, Senran Kagura was affected and it was already rated by the ESRB and even though I'm no expert on the US rating system I doubt it would've been if it included something illegal.

[alpacaman]

You're right. Societal norms would be the more fitting term. Facebook, PayPal and so on have similar terms of service despite US laws not forcing them to. I guess it's a mix of them being scared of conservative lobby groups protesting and also not wanting to censor stuff individually for countries where certain content actually is illegal since it's too much work.

[Thyndd]

8 hours ago, r0xm2n said:

Censorship and Political Correctness (for the most part) are about to go extinct though....

Where exactly? I need to move there asap. 

I remember saying this earlier in some other topic... As much as I like bashing religion and finding things to blame it for, I honesty don't think the sexual taboo originates within the Christian dogma. Sure, Christianity strongly  incorporates this repudiation against sexuality, but so do other unrelated religions and cultures throughout the globe, each in their own degree. After all, most peoples exhibit at the very least the shyness to cover up their bodies. Something must be going on in our psyches that's just deeper than "it's just a culturally adquired custom". Of course it still doesn't make any sense, so we should know better than blindly following our instincts. 

[ciel_yuri]

4 hours ago, alpacaman said:

You're right. Societal norms would be the more fitting term. Facebook, PayPal and so on have similar terms of service despite US laws not forcing them to. I guess it's a mix of them being scared of conservative lobby groups protesting and also not wanting to censor stuff individually for countries where certain content actually is illegal since it's too much work.

Conservative groups only really seem worried about violence in video games. Which Sony has no problems with. It's more that the video game industry is flooded with SJWs who consider everything sexist, "problematic", "toxic" or some other buzzword. The gaming news outlets (which, coincidentally, are predominantly located in the state where Sony just moved) has been pushing all this stuff for awhile now. Most aren't even bothering to let people know that Sony is doing this, because many of them actually applaud it.

[Plk_Lesiak]

1 hour ago, ciel_yuri said:

Conservative groups only really seem worried about violence in video games. Which Sony has no problems with. It's more that the video game industry is flooded with SJWs who consider everything sexist, "problematic", "toxic" or some other buzzword. The gaming news outlets (which, coincidentally, are predominantly located in the state where Sony just moved) has been pushing all this stuff for awhile now. Most aren't even bothering to let people know that Sony is doing this, because many of them actually applaud it.

This is so untrue though. All kinds of media outlets are traditionally involved in the "video games promote violence" fallacy. It's a cyclical source of sensationalist bullshit that has little to do with any kind of ideology, unless it involves scapegoating video games to detract from discussing actual societal issues. It's tabloid journalism above anything else. 

The pornography and sexual content in media are a prime topic for various consevative lobbies, like the one that celebrated Valve's move against anime games. They don't focus solely on games, but are also very consistent in their demands for censorship (unlike those "SJWs" - stances on pornography are extremely varied within the feminist movenent and its most harsh opponents are a bit of a dying breed). You'll find religious extremists at the frontline of every fight against sexual content and it's sadly that kind of mentality that drives the policies of many companies, especially in the US. Obviously, the left wing critique of female representation is also a factor, but it's not the feminists that dictated the puritanic approach to public representations of sexuality that is still so prevalent in the US. Some of them contribute to the problem, but not with the same consistency social conservatives do. 

Edited October 31, 2018 by Plk_Lesiak

[Thyndd]

To sum it up, what we can see is two extremist ideologies that, parting from opposite sides, end up in the exact same place. Nothing new under the sun. And it's always the individual rights that get compromised, sadly. 

[Clockwork Loli]

I've heard of this lately.  I don't know what they're actually thinking going through with this and strangling their home market like that.  Corporate mistake?  Or something more disingenuous?

[Ranzo]

Yeah, it seems pretty bogus that sony is pulling this rank censorship with it's games man. It doesn't seem like their is any coherent messages from them regarding their decision so I guess we'll just have to wait for that. I don't get the whole religious angle you guyz are peddling though since one it's a Japanese company and two, I'm pretty sure most if not all game companies are secular to a fault. I also don't see any evidence that this is thanks to everyone's favorite boogieman either.

[alpacaman]

4 minutes ago, Ranzo said:

Yeah, it seems pretty bogus that sony is pulling this rank censorship with it's games man. It doesn't seem like their is any coherent messages from them regarding their decision so I guess we'll just have to wait for that. I don't get the whole religious angle you guyz are peddling though since one it's a Japanese company and two, I'm pretty sure most if not all game companies are secular to a fault. I also don't see any evidence that this is thanks to everyone's favorite boogieman either.

Of course most companies aren't religious. They still have to appeal to local sensitivities and try to avoid public outcries since both affect their image and sales.

[Ranzo]

5 minutes ago, alpacaman said:

Of course most companies aren't religious. They still have to appeal to local sensitivities and try to avoid public outcries since both affect their image and sales.

I get that but that doesn't really explain this recent bought of censoring. I wonder what event or decision made them change their policy.  

[alpacaman]

1 hour ago, Ranzo said:

I get that but that doesn't really explain this recent bought of censoring.

That's true, it's just a sub-discussion that came up when somebody asked why violence and sexual content are treated so differently.

1 hour ago, Ranzo said:

I wonder what event or decision made them change their policy.  

Nobody except the executives can say for sure. My guess would be that banning sexual content makes it easier to reach into growing markets like China that have pretty strict censorship laws. The Japanese market is probably shrinking considering Japan's economic and demographic development and in other parts of the world the share of potential customers you scare away from buying your consoles buy announcing you don't allow bare breasts on your platforms anymore should be pretty small.

[Clockwork Loli]

13 minutes ago, alpacaman said:

That's true, it's just a sub-discussion that came up when somebody asked why violence and sexual content are treated so differently.

Nobody except the executives can say for sure. My guess would be that banning sexual content makes it easier to reach into growing markets like China that have pretty strict censorship laws. The Japanese market is probably shrinking considering Japan's economic and demographic development and in other parts of the world the share of potential customers you scare away from buying your consoles buy announcing you don't allow bare breasts on your platforms anymore should be pretty small.

Right now, there are just too many unknowns to justify the blame towards SJWs, feminists and religious conservatives.  There needs to be actual evidence first because all we got going are a couple of articles explaining the situation and nothing more.

[alpacaman]

That's why I said I'm guessing. I'm not blameing anyone for Sony's changes in policy. Sony executives probably wouldn't have made this choice if they didn't think it would benefit the company financially in the long term.

[littleshogun]

About the reason of sex censorship while at the same time didn't censor the violence from religion angle, I admit that it's quite eye opener to me although it's not fully the truth anyway (And no I won't explain my thought here because religion were pretty much a sensitive issue). As for the reason of why Sony tightening their censor, in the end we can only guess the reason although if we talk about China it's quite tight on censorship indeed. By the way my newest guess would be perhaps Sony here was got panicked with their censorship act, and they'll probably will be like Steam after realizing that they shoot their own leg with the censorship in Japan.

Edited November 13, 2018 by littleshogun

[SaintOfVoid]

48 minutes ago, littleshogun said:

if we talk about China it's quite tight on censorship indeed....will be like Steam after realizing that they shoot their own leg with the censorship in Japan.

steam´s current success, and even more so after its new "everything goes" policy, is what massively ticks chinese government officals off. Heard from many sources there, that this can´t and won´t go on any much longer. Makes you curious though how much a super-regulated/censored plattform will affect sales, especially those of western publishers who went/ are planning to go tri-language mode